No City Can Feed Its Own People

You might say that cities are artificial. No city can feed its own people. Although they are centers of lots of population and activity, a city can only exist at the expense of resources from elsewhere. Cities cannot make it on their own. Not even a chance.

From a survival preparedness standpoint, cities are a big red flag. A place not to be when there has been a major disaster. Think about the dependencies. Food, Water, and All Consumable Supplies are trucked in from somewhere else. Although this is similarly the case for the suburbs, and lesser so for rural areas, the fact that so much (of everything) has to be brought in to to a city for support of such a large concentration of human beings is the Achilles Heel.

I read this recently, “No city can feed its own people.” None of them. Cities are not self-sufficient. Not even close. When you think seriously and logically about all of the absolute dependencies that cities have upon supplies and distribution, and combine that with population density, well those urbanites better hope that nothing disrupts the flow for more than just a short time!

Cities depend upon farmers from the countryside, and food sources that range from all over the world depending on season. Not only that, but the cities depend 100 percent on the web of distribution chains such as big trucks, little trucks, trains, planes, etc.., to deliver everything. I’ve read estimates that cities may only have about one week worth of food at any one time! Let that sink in…

Not only do supplies need to come in, but trash and sewer needs to be brought out. These systems also have dependencies like trucking, electricity, and social order.

Citywide Lack of Food, Water, Gas, and Supplies Will Quickly Result in Social Chaos

This is all invisible to the city dweller, and is entirely taken for granted that the systems will not be disrupted.

Following a major collapse, some of the biggest and immediate dangers will be social chaos brought on by shortages or lack of food, water, gas, supplies. The water demands for a city are enormous. When the water stops, it will become even more desperate than when the food runs out.

Imagine the modern buildings and apartment dwellings within the cities. Nearly all of them require an operating HVAC system (Heating, Ventilation, and Air Conditioning). Without it, temperatures will SOAR beyond bearable conditions in the summer and will PLUMMET in the winter. This will make it nearly impossible to live in them without electricity. Imagine all those people?

In a major disaster, this could all come about within days. Less than a week. Those who had failed to get out while they had a chance, will be doomed to very dangerous and difficult times indeed with their very survival at stake. There is even the risk that a city may become quarantined with all major routes in and out blocked.

Be aware that cities are death traps following major disaster.

Your survival will depend upon having a plan BEFORE disaster strikes. Know multiple routes out of the city, including routes that are NOT major routes. If collapse actually occurs, get out IMMEDIATELY. Better yet, stay out altogether. Or move.

[ Read: When The Trucks Stop, It’s Over ]

66 Comments

  1. ” Life on the farm is kind’a laid back, there is nothing this old boy can’t hack, early to rise, early in the sack, THANK GOD I’M A COUNTRY BOY”! (The late John Denver)

  2. It is with some pleasure that I peruse the produce aisles at grocery stores looking for produce that came from my local area growing up. What I take pleasure in researching will mean times of shortages and hardship if and when the trucks stop running. I made it a point to move from my old home in Cali to the breadbasket of my current state of OR. It is easier to be a locavore when you are surrounded by small farms and people that raise their own livestock.

    1. Cali,
      I’m sure you realize, there will be no joy in groceryville. Those small farms with livestock, not likely to be welcome there either. The suburbs and areas “just outside of the city” are NOT a good place to be. I hope I’m wrong, but everything could change in a day or two.

    2. (This comment is not directed at Calirefugee.)
      There are many Commiefornians who have moved to Oregon and Washington over the years.
      If and when SHTF in Cali that substantial population will be booking out to the northwest. Those states are “spiritually” tied by political dogma and Communist ideology. AZ has their 2A crowd and the Utes will probably build a wall. I have no sympathy for Cali. End of story.

  3. Want proof of this concept? Watch what happens to a cage full of lab rats when the lab assistant forgets to feed them for a day. Yeah, not pretty.

  4. The most basic element is the killer. Water. Whatever the cause, when clean tap water is no longer available, the lack of Twinkies, Ho Hos, and Beer will become minor irritations. People will herd (as best they can) to the nearest source of what they perceive as clean water.

    Many will hold there position waiting for the .gov to come and rescue them and it won’t happen.

    People will riot when the EBT cards quit working, but it will be much more awful when the water quits. I have never seen anyone die of thirst and don’t want to….

    <bb

    1. I live in close proximity to the forks of two rivers on a high terrace and have been told by others that I will have water and food resources that I can obtain from the rivers should a disaster strike. Those rivers do not exist on plan A, B or C for me. I know it has to do a lot with what development is in a watershed but I believe they will be toxic in a matter of days and would not even consider using them for any resources. Their greatest benefit will be in the form of barriers limiting the movement of people.

  5. First time posting been reading articles here for a few years.
    We are screwed
    IRS, FBI, ATF all of the alphabet soup agencies need to go bye bye.

  6. For older folks, folks with physical challenges, or any city dwellers without a plan. Be watchful for each other. Older folks may know what needs to be done and how to do it. Younger folks can be their students. Together you can survive. Churches, patriotic events, Veterans Day happenings, gun shows could be places to make such connections. The risk between trusting others versus probably dying in the city should be considered. I am finally really rural and sleeping better than I have for years.

  7. Tha current metro area population of Los Angeles in 2022 is 12,488,000, a 0.23% increase from 2021.

    Here is a simple question.
    If/When TSHTF and as Ken proposes, “get the heck out of the Shities”
    Where are those 12.488 million folks going to go…. ?
    And that’s just one little city.

    1. NrP & Blue,
      I am hoping most of them bug-in (until it’s too late to bugout) and any that jackrabbit out of there only get as far as AZ or NV. You and Blue would be drafted to do border patrol duty down there in the 4 Corners. ( don’t worry too much, not many will make it across the Navajo lands).

      1. Minerjim,
        Ever drive from ABQ north to the CO border?
        Imagine walking that “without” the support of everything.
        Thinking Ole Blue will be fine, even eastern AZ would be a problem for sure.

        1. Lot of “empty” ground between ABQ and the border for sure. We may have to send relief to the Navajo Nation to keep them from being overrun. Major corridors out of Kommiefornia would be littered with dead and dying. Nice nightmare you brought up there Ol Son.

          1. Minerjim:
            Don’t know about you. But I got no nightmares from this stuff.
            Just food for thought.
            Hence we, most folks here, prepare and pray we never need that Deep Pantry

          2. NRP,
            Well yeah, we will be OK too. That said, if shtf, I know I will not be able to avoid thinking about the unprepared and their suffering. You and everyone else won’t either. It would be a “nightmare scenario” that would weigh heavily on all survivor’s minds. (How will that affect how we all think/operate after shtf?) A little more food for thought.

    2. NRP – Dumbass LA Vatos, and other ghetto mongrels can barely take over a city block to rob a 7-11. War game time. If they go north, they will find the Newhall pass closed and several thousand off-duty LEO’s past the closure. Up the coast on PCH, two lane, winding, the first clapped-out hoopty to wreck stops forward movement and backs them up to LAX. If they head south, they’ll get as far as Huntington Beach or Irvine, where they will simply be mowed down and not a word will be spoken of it. Eastbound they will bottleneck the East LA interchange and probably kill each other. Hopefully they’ll go west and simply drown. The few stragglers who make it past 605 will be greeted by my son and those like him, probably from an overpass. Whatever remains can be flushed down the storm drain, or pasteurized and sold as organic dog food. Ain’t skeered.

      1. Tmac:
        Could not imagine living in a big shitty anymore, to many years in the boonies.
        But you’re right about the bottle neck of SOCA.
        No where to go. Unless ya leave very quickly and quietly.

    3. NRP & Blue, Most Angelinos have basically three options: drown in the water, die of thirst in the desert, or stay in the city to perish in the civil disorder. The tv movie After Armageddon addresses this topic with expert commentary: youtu.be/envGrJA3_UM

    4. Depending on the nature of the disaster befalling that city, there really is no place to go…as the city is basically a big bowl, tilted toward the coast, which is surrounded by steep, arid, mountains and broad deserts. If people are walking, having to carry everything on their backs, they will no get very far, any direction they decide to go.

      People attempting to flee must still walk past all those other people watching them…they struggle to carry all that nice stuff past those very interested observers.

      If it is a large quake…and total power outage..forget it. Now, you will have to worry about fires, about downed buildings and bridges, about the harbor being made inoperable by silting up, tsunami possibility, chemical spills and oil and gas refineries and storage issues. The only water will be in your water heaters and your swimming pools…there will be no other…

      If you are in Los Angeles when the S… hits, your desiccated body will probably still be there…100 years later.

  8. I remember watching several Seinfeld episodes.
    NYC, I believe.
    Stop in the deli/coffee stand for lunch. Visit the grocer for that night’s supper.
    Convenience, yes.
    But damn trouble when it all goes to hell.

    There was a college student in front of me, years ago.
    Can of soup and a loaf of bread.
    Tonight’s meal? The cashier asked.
    Yes, yes, it is, replied the student.

    I just shook my head

  9. Im glad we dont really have any “cities” here on Maui, we have towns, most real small, and lots of small scale agriculture interspersed.
    Our rural area is ideal, really a pretty tight community when all is exposed, lots of good people.
    A true city, IMHO, is just a nightmare

  10. Reply to Plainsmedic: Our biggest city around here is Portland, OR and it is over 50 miles away. The city I work in is also the seat of govt for this state. Agriculture is big in this portion of the state and most of the farmers and ranchers are small in scale compared to California where I came from. I live in the suburbs because I work “in town”. Some of the farming families know me now because I helped their family members get an “in-town job”. These are some of the people I barter and trade for fresh eggs, produce and shares of beef, pork or lamb. I also network with some ag types at my local gun club and I am still doing odd jobs in pest control.

    The local news is doing a series on the downhill slide of Portland’s business district. Nobody wants to go downtown to work, eat out, go to Blazer Games or go to the sports arena to see the Thorns or the Timbers play anymore. 7 shootings in SE Portland over the weekend, park your car overnight to find it or the catalytic converter gone. Homeless camps and violence around them are always in the news. People with resources are selling their homes and relocating elsewhere. Fortunately for me, many of the people that ran a restaurant or food cart in Portland are relocating south along the I-5 corridor where they can run their business in relative peace.

  11. Reply to bb_in_GA: How right you are about water or lack of it. Los Angeles exists only because of the water that is imported there from the Colorado River, Owen’s Valley and water from Northern Cali that gets shipped south through the Central Valley system of canals and pipelines. In the meantime, the groundwater in the Central Valley gets so low that only the deepest wells can pump up the water and the quality of the resulting water is not good in extreme drought years. I heard Tmac mention something about desalination plants along the coast of Southern Cali. Despite the energy draw and what to do with the resulting salt accumulation, I am afraid Southern Cali will have to do this in the near future if it is not being done already. The Southern end of the Central Valley around Coalinga, Wasco and Bakersfield are pretty barren in extreme drought years. (When they have water, they grow most of the melons around this region because the high temps raise the sugar content of the honeydews, watermelons and cantalopes in the long, hot summers)

    1. Calirefugee…

      There was a desalination plant being built, a huge one, just to the south of the city, along the coast. But, Sacramento recently stopped it completely. NO DESALINATION PLANTS ARE PLANNED…and those that exist, now…which are extremely successful in making lots of clean water…are not going to be expanded.

      The “salt” issue is totally a political fabrication..as there really can be no such issue of any merit. The ocean is simply too salty, as it is, to fret about the salt it retains because some water evaporated from it….which is exactly what already happens every single second the Pacific Ocean has existed. The “salt” issue is entirely fictional.

      But, no matter….no desalination plants for any of you…

      1. That will be the next crises, too much evaporation, oh lord we are overloading the system and causing too much evaporation!
        New rubber diapers because there are too many farts

        1. Kulafarmer – Rubber diapers are a no no. “Silencers” must be regulated. As we see from the “baby klot shots”…. they are restricting these offensive weapons and soon their diaper “silencers”. As for adult diapers? How does one silence the blast from a an ear splitting cannon with a diaper? Or…. deal with the “silent but deadly” (SBD) version of this weapon of “mess” destruction? They deaden the primer of course.

          1. Cali and Ision were talking about important stuff and you guys thread-jacked it to a POTATUS chat.

  12. I’m in the middle of WI, the state has a population on just under 6 million.
    The person I live with thinks the city people in a disaster situation of any kind will stay in the cities.
    I asked him where the will go for food or water he thinks the gov will move in and deal with it.. I tried explaining but I’m uneducated while HE has a collage degree and knows better.

    I said but they will want food, flat screen tv’s and things to drink.
    He said there’s no food out here, look around he says, no food.

    Again I tried explaining people generally think there is food in the countryside, in farm houses.. in fields.
    His response, yes the silo’s are full they can eat that..
    Doesn’t know there is no national stockpile because he will not hear what I try to tell him.

    He really thinks farmers stored grains can feed the nation, he thinks city people would eat grains, raw grains provided by the gov.

    He’ll have to see for himself.

  13. The democrat government will mostly protect the democrat voters at the expense of most everyone else. Government will take over all food production and distribution systems to feed their constituents. A republican government will not protect republican voters that way, but they will probably still take over food production and distribution systems just the same. The government always thinks it can fix anything, while being the main reason why most government run programs do not work.

    The article is correct in that big cities need outside support. The question is how is big defined? Is a big city defined as a population greater than 10,000 or more than 2,000 or any city without enough land to grow food to feed the number of people living there? Maybe a city with multi-family dwellings that have no food raising space? Or every city whose climate is not conducive to growing things?

    Moving out of a city is an answer to survival. It mustn’t be the only answer or the best answer. The better answer requires major changes in policies and procedures so these types of situations will not occur. I know it isn’t likely, but it must be possible.

  14. That guy/gal ya know who lives rural. Friendly and helpful. When 100’s or 1000’s of people are trampling whatever crops he/she may have, things will change. When it’s your family at risk, your circle of true friends shrinks. People get comfortable in their surroundings. They know how things work and where to get those things they require. Normalcy bias. We all have it, to various degrees.

    This will be horrific. Beyond the experience of any of us. I understand the inclination to think, “I can make it work here.” If ‘here’ is in or even near a city, I believe you’re mistaken. A very few days into it, all those cars that normally drive down the streets, will be still. People on foot. People hungry/thirsty/desperate to provide for themselves and family. These, normally decent people, will kill you to provide for their family.

    Those of us in rural America will experience it too. On a much much smaller scale. It only takes one mistake. Now, do ya want to have incidents every few days or hourly? What are your chances/choices?

    1. Plainsmedic, I don’t worry so much about city-dwellers coming out here where we live. My biggest threat is our neighbors. They are ‘takers.’ They do whatever they please, whenever they please, and don’t care about how it affects anyone. We’ve had to spend thousands of dollars to repair our property (they caused drainage issues on ours backing up natural run-off) where they did ‘improvements’ to theirs. Promised us for two years they were going to fix everything. Never did. Wife also sprayed my grapevines – on our property – with Roundup and killed them.. Giggled, and was so sorry. Yeah. Right. We just avoid them, but know the kind of people they are. Their dogs killed our chickens – in our yard, even digging under our fence to get them. I could go on, but you get it. “Takers.” They will be the biggest problem wherever they are, I think. Thoughts?

    2. Plainsmedic you have nailed it…..”circle of friends” is in reality a “circle of acquaintances” even outside family will likely be a problem. This is not going to be an event that can be understood by using the calm logic of how it is in the present sense, this is going to be a surreal apocalypse in your face situation that consume most people before they can react let alone adjust. That adjustment needs to start today, not at the start of a do do event…just saying, remember Will Rogers adage that “there are three types of people in the world, those who make things happen, those that watch things happen, and those that wonder what in the hell just happened.”

  15. Ken:

    A follow on article to this might be on how those outside the cities might best prepare for the massive exodus when the doo-doo starts to hit. I’m sure there are plenty of ideas out there amongst the MSB readers/posters.

  16. My first job in Natural Resources Management was an internship for the Los Padres National Forest. The department I worked in was Civil Engineering. My job was to update the maps for fire road access. I was informed by one of the civil engineers of the Mission Statement of the National Forest in Southern California was water conservation and water quality. I was taught that the hills covered with vegetation led to better water quality downstream and the hills acted as a freshwater reservoir. Having grown up in California for most of my life, I knew that this made the USFS- Los Padres Unit a big political player in California Politics. There are many reasons one will abandon their childhood home for another location: Lack of money, good jobs, water from the faucet, schools for our children. Lack of food is an unspoken priority for many people that currently reside in a larger city. There are many reasons to leave a big city beyond food availability.

  17. I live in the “borderhood” of an awful city. I also live near the hospital where my husband just spent 15 days, & the companies that are now part of his health care. I’ve learned a lot from folks like all of you & have prepared as able. For those of you who say water is a big problem, I agree. The evening news from Jackson, Mississippi shows what a problem water is for cities even without a complete breakdown (though we are beaking down). I think whether or not you get over-run in the country depends on the kind of crisis. My neighbors could never make it to the country & I’m pretty sure they wouldn’t recognize a field of crops. Perhaps the working poor who are skilled at repair & have cars they keep running are a threat. But most of the folks in the hood unlikely to be trampling the fields. They are a mess. With them it will go down right here.

    1. MnRuby,
      Pearl? i live about 60 miles from there and did some work at the OB Curtis plant when it was being built. that was only 20 yrs ago but it has never been maintained. government in inaction. those people are under boiled water alerts every month.
      those people trampling the fields? ha, they will just stay and keep shooting each other. it’s all they know how to to do. good riddance to bad rubbish. the flooding has had my internet down for two days but it is all good here.
      take care

  18. people in the city’s, don’t wait!!!! go go go
    in the event of a long term grid down situation they’re will be a lot of red x’s on doors with numbers at the bottom to mark the remains of those who waited for help. they used many cans of spray paint in new orleans in 2005 to mark the doors of people who waited for help that never came. the cajun navy was there but we couldn’t get to everyone.
    everyone should have seen that, or maybe not. i still have bad dreams about it. i was only there for five days as DW and her family were dealing with no elect. and water, they will always come first to me. they did fine without me. DW is a country girl from birth and she knows the drill.
    mississippi’s coast looked like an atomic bomb had been dropped on it. it was flattened five miles inland. many people there were killed, they had a week’s notice and just set there and got washed out to sea.

  19. This brought up the thought “golden horde” I think from the book Patriots.
    Garbage and destruction in their wake.

    What’s a person to do if your on private property, surrounded by the horde that’s making demands.
    There could be 10 of you and a hundred/hundreds of them.
    They have weapons, they WILL have weapons. and your screwed.
    That scares me.

    I see two options there, give in hoping you have anything left after they go away, second get someone to snipe and direct them away if your fortunate to have advanced warning.
    A third would have quite a large force on your side to intimidate but you have to be on guard forever after that.

    t’s a scary idea, city’s can sustain for I think 5 to 10 days possibly with the food available within
    before people get desperate.
    Violence would be historic, death the norm.

    1. Horse,

      Praying we never have to face such decisions, but I’ve pondered those same possibilities. “Flash mobs” taking over stores and looting them are quite common now…and these are “good times”. One can only imagine what may occur when it’s desperate act of hunger and survival.

      This has been discussed before on MSB. Do you wait for the mob to reach your home before engaging…how much force can you…or will you employ? Do you take steps to prevent them from ever reaching your home…what steps…again how much force?

      Might be time for that discussion to be re-visited.

      1. Dennis,
        You bring up good points. Answer will be Local dependent. In the upper Midwest, apparently standing in front of your house with a pistol to show a ‘presence’ to a destructive mob will bring the cops to arrest you. Whereas here in the boonies, an old curmudgeon miner with a shotgun ‘showing presence’ to anyone with ill-intent would be considered an appropriate response.
        I’ve had several times where just the sight of a holstered sidearm on my hip corrected the attitude of a couple of drunks. Sometimes the hardest thing to do is to to keep yourself from escalating the situation. Jmho.

      2. In a survival situation, were it is just you…and yours…and…them, if the mob gets to your home, expect to loose everything, including your life, if you fight.

        So, try to identify a mob at a distance, and, then, engage it at a distance in such a manner to prevent mob members from knowing who is engaging them. It is not time to be polite, or to warn, or to inform. It is not time to barter, or talk, or answer any questions. It is not time to “scare them off,” or bluff, or pull your punches.

        A violent mob, which is actively engaging in looting and attacking people in their homes, does not deserve any kindness, or restraint…even if many in the mob seem to be just “standing around,” watching.

        Coordinate your armed defenders to maximize your effective targeting and rate of fire, then, from a location OTHER than your home’s walls, engage the mob, dropping as many as you can..wounding is just fine..as quick as you can…and continue to fire until there are no more targets of value. Then move to a new position to either rear flank, from which you can observe your old position, and wait…to engage any counter attack, just in case one manifests.

        Do not snipe the wounded, or anyone attempting to aid them. Watch for wide flanking maneuvers, via long lines of sight…and just wait, reload your magazines, drink water…and listen.

        Chances are you will have made a profound impression in the mob survivors that your area is not a nice place to hang…and they really have no idea who did it to them…how many of you there are…or if you can do it again, should they return.

        In any case, it is more likely you will be dealing with a completely new mob…rather than skirmishers from the old, who are at a disadvantage, being offense.

        I can think of no other solution, other than fleeing…to prepared locations in a plan of constant retreat.

  20. To Scout, Horse and Dennis: Taking a note from Katrina a while ago, When New Orleans was heavily damaged, Some did try to relocate by walking out. Some of the towns where they went, they were met by Neighborhood Watch groups that were armed at that point. Other locations/larger estates, people would walk up driveways until they observed a little red dot on their chest from a laser sight/pointer. Journalist’s from the New York Times tried to travel down there and were met with the same greeting on the peripheral neighborhoods before getting close to New Orlean’s Ground Zero. Lots of armed security groups around neighborhoods and suburbs…Not a lot of food being passed out for free. Other note of a more helpful nature: FEMA observed one indicator of Storm Impact and Recovery scale: The Waffle House Index. The most heavily impacted areas, nothing was open to include the Waffle House franchise. In areas that were hit and suffered moderate damage, Waffle House was open with limited menu options. In areas that were hit lightly, the Waffle House was open with full service/full menu options. I found it VERY interesting that the top staff that ran the Waffle House Chain were appointed to jobs within FEMA in the years following Katrina. During the Pandemic of the past 2 years, there was only one type of restaurant that benefited: The franchise that could sell whole meals inside of a “clamshell” or take-out container with fast service.

    1. Calirefugee,

      “Rooftop Koreans” have become a thing of folklore since the Rodney King unpleasantness. You were up close and personal in that affair.

      Does anyone know if the Koreans had a plan in place prior to the riots…did they just play it by ear (wing it)?…if so, how long did it take for them to coalesce into a viable defense? I know that in the larger cities, Asians tend to have close knit communities based on country and cultural backgrounds of origin…tend to take care of internal problems among themselves. I know there was a building friction between Koreans and blacks prior to Rodney King.

      1. During the Rodney King riots, aware they were only burning their own neighborhoods…some of the upset tried to organize a motor caravan into Semi Valley, in order to riot in the most white neighborhoods, instead.

        They made the mistake of telling too many people and the word got out to people living in Semi Valley, who then organized an armed Militia and built roadblocks and breastworks to stop any column from the San Fernando Valley.

        The rioter’s got the message and no attempt was made, as everyone in such an attempt would have been terminated before they could get out of their rides…. They were lucky.

        Do not think that practically each street will not have its makeshift band of homeowners quickly arranging their defense…blocking easy access with their cars…and making defensive walls with their trash cans filled with debris…as bulletproofs. Movement of any kind…anywhere…will be difficult because of this.

  21. Everyone will have their own set of circumstances they have to deal with based on their choices. When I moved from a heavily populated area to where I am now (not ideal…but good), I made it a point to be a gray man. Virtually no “friends” but some acquaintances (mostly Amish) who raise livestock and such. I deal with them and they have come to know me as honest and resourceful. I am a loner. I will pick my “friends” when the time comes under stressful situations based on their actions….or inaction. I visit local churches, gun clubs, and fire company dinners in the area from time to time to gauge the folks. Most are “paper christians” or those impressed with their skills under non-stress. Some will rise to the occasion I think….but I keep my distance for now. When trouble comes, I intend to avoid it….side step it….get out of the way. It is VERY comforting to me that I have built my skills over the years to do that. I know what my capabilities and limitations are because I practice, fast, and test myself. All one needs to do is focus on the 7 necessities to sustain life, in the simplest terms. Simple tools with knowledge and skills. I will be where the resources are. If you are not able to move out of troubles path, you will become a victim….in the city or the country. My home is where I am…..not an address. I will teach my new friends, and they will teach me. Is my way the only way? Nope. May God have mercy on us all in these end days. When my time comes, I want to know that I did what was right in HIS eyes…..not mine.

    1. SoulSurvival,

      Everyone sees themselves differently in their own eyes…some seeing themselves worse than others, some as better. I’ll share a little joke about three guys who showed up at Heaven at the same time…..

      Saint Peter welcomed them but admonished them to be careful and not step on any frogs as they walked around. They asked what would happen if they did accidently…Peter just repeated the admonishment and added “You don’t want to find out”. As they entered, they discovered that frogs were everywhere you looked, and you really had to pay attention to avoid them.

      In a short time, one of them accidently stepped on a frog…an angel appeared with the ugliest woman you could imagine, chained them together and told them they were joined for an eternity.

      Wasn’t much longer, the second guy stepped on one and just like the first, was chained for eternity to the ugliest woman he had ever seen.

      Observing this, the third guy became very serious about avoiding the frogs …successfully for a long time. An angel appeared with the most beautiful woman he had ever laid eyes on…and chained them together.

      Not believing his good fortune, he blurted out “I don’t know what I’ve done to deserve this”….the woman replied, “I don’t know what you did, but I stepped on a frog.”

      1. Dennis – I’ll share a little true story about stepping on a frog. One day this cop responds as back-up to a crash not in his sector. Once on scene and the dynamics were understood, this cop pulls the supervisor aside and offers to handle “the hard part” so the sector guy doesn’t have to. The sector guy was having some unrelated problems at the time. The supervisor agrees but had reservations for all parties involved. So this cop does what needed to be done regarding the drunken cop that caused the crash. You see, the drunken cop was very popular among his peers and had been given numerous breaks by others. So…. this cop committed job related suicide as evident by the many “calls” from others….to include a “high ranking” FOP guy. Hell….the Deputy District Attorney even asked what could be done ….off the record of course. His answer….”its already been done”. The drunk cop entered a guilty plea. Stepping on a frog? This cop crushed a barrel of ’em with one shot…..and paid the price. Being a loner ain’t so hard….once you get the hang of it. Hey Dennis……you ever have a problem getting back-up?

        1. SoulSurvivor,

          No, never had that problem. I try to do what’s right even when it’s not easy. Some things I can tolerate, some things I can’t. Taking the easy way out ain’t always easy for me.

          I’ve got this problem…every time I find myself finding fault in what others are doing, I start looking at myself and my own shortcomings. I’m my own worst critic. I try to see myself as others might, and sometimes I don’t like what I see. This can create an inner conflict when dealing with evil around you. You want to correct that evil, but you are also keenly aware that you are an imperfect man in an imperfect world casting stones.

          Some might see me as too meek. Those that know me well, know that I can go from mild mannered to not so accommodating in a blink. It’s a full-time endeavor to keep it balanced.

          1. Dennis
            You said you are your own worst critic,
            I am my own worst enemy as well as critic,
            Its tough sometimes

          2. Dennis – I hear what you are saying…..all of it. I tell myself I am still teachable. I wonder if that is true. The stones I throw are not so much at the person, but to get their attention and warn. You would think I might have learned by now that some of the stones I throw bounce back and hit me in the face (probably putting too much spin on them)….but I keep chucking them. How smart is that? If brains were dynamite ………. My Dad always told me to do more for others than myself. He never mentioned the consequences. Take care and take my prayers, for you and your family, with you in your journey.

    2. SoulSurvival
      All is good with your post….. until you have an accident and break your hand, or leg. You can’t plan an accident. As careful as we all are, accidents are gonna happen to everyone of us.

      What Y’all gonna do then? Call Ghost Busters? Lone Wolf is a lonely and hard trail to follow.

  22. We are 49 miles by car, to the S.W. corner of Atlanta. We downsized to a smaller acreage and rebuilt some of what we left that we could care for, now that we are getting older. We can feed ourselves for a very long time, if left alone. We can defend ourselves….for awhile…not forever.
    In the year and a half since we moved to this spot, acreages have been sold off all the way down the road. Homes have been built and sold. Some sit way off the road. The only reason we know they are there, are the long drives and good new gates. There are other areas going up as well. I have no idea who or what these people are. They bought at least 5 acres, but I don’t know what that means. Would they even have time to prepare? It takes time to add resources, they don’t just pop up. We have two a few good neighbors, but I am only sure that one is prepared. You have to trust someone. The questions is, how much time does a person have to build that kind of relationship. We left an area like that and I think we made a mistake we now have to live with.

  23. Reply to Dennis in regards to the Rooftop Koreans after a geographical clarification to Ision: I believe Ision was referring to a very conservative enclave north of Los Angeles known as: Simi Valley. Lots of off duty LASO and LAPD choose to purchase their suburbistan homes in Simi Valley. If you lived and worked in and around Los Angeles, you too would choose to be armed as much as the law allows. The Rooftop Koreans were organized along business associations with their roots going back to some of the first generation that served in South Korean Military. (also known as ROK’s). As business owners, they had to learn the rules of the game in terms of opening and operating a business in a foreign land where they did not understand the language or the rules. Many of the business owners were not just members of the Korean Military, Many of the community and civic leaders were officers in the ROKs prior to their arrival. When the defecation made contact with the rotary oscillater in South Central, They organized along their old military rank and file. There was also sharing of resources that took place as the first buildings were going up in flames. The restaurants made and distributed food. The gun shops (of which there were several) passed out firearms and ammo to all Korean owned businesses. These folks were also members that attended the same church during peaceful times and their children went to school together and intermarried. The same thing took place among the Japanese Americans during WW2 and the aftermath. I saw and assisted some of the members of the South Vietnamese community in San Jose, CA before I left. (filling out job apps for LE agencies, teaching safety and handling of fire arms within the home, Filling out apps for colleges and trade schools). Though I am 3rd Gen Japanese American, I have Vietnamese in-laws.

  24. Other tidbits of information from the Rodney King Riots part 2. (The first Rodney King Riot was smaller in scale and did not make the National News feed. Part 2 was where we watched Reginald Denny get pulled out of his truck and got brain damaged from the beating he sustained that day). The first 24 hrs the National Guard was posted on the street corners, they did not have a single round of ammunition for their 9mm pistols or their 5.56 rifles. All they had was riot gear, helmets and bayonets. All the LEO agencies had ammo that was hollow point therefore, not OK to give to the National Guard standing there with an empty weapon. All California LEO agencies have their ammo distributed to them and are subject to accountability at each qualification. (Winchester white box with the lot # recorded). If ammo gets lost due to faulty magazine buttplate breaking during a fight or a foot pursuit? – oh well. There will be an investigation about the missing ammo. The Koreans who found out about all this information just shook their heads and laughed. I saw a few officers clap their hands when the shop owner of a liquer store fired shot shells at looters trying to open the security grating. “They no get my store!” (boom-rack-boom-rack-boom)

  25. Continuation of Rodney King Riots of 1992: Some police agencies were transitioning from 9mm to the then-new 40 S&W. Once you were in the LA basin, 40 S&W was difficult to find on the store shelves back then. Other cops were still carrying the 38 Special and 357 magnum that day. I recall, the wheelgun users were able to find ammo on the store shelves where those that carried 9mm, 45 acp and 40 smith: ammo was spotty in availability at best. (remember that Noah built his ark BEFORE the rain started) Patrol cars were coming out of the Hot Zone and stopping at an open market and were loading up the trunk with: cases of bottled water in pint bottles, snack foods like slim jims, string cheese, gorp or trail mix, caffeinated sodas and baby wipes to clean up with. I do not remember seeing a 7 lb bag of ice until about a week later when things were quiet on the radio and smoke was still spiralling up from South Central. I also remember seeing lots of birdshot available on the shelves of Big 5 sporting goods. As a former Fed officer, I remember getting training in riot control and we watched films of riots being managed in Sao Palo, Brazil. The officers lined up an a phalanx and began to walk forward firing birdshot at the feet of the protesters from 50 yards away. Advance 5 steps-fire 1 round. Repeat until the street is clear. Since that day, one of my preps within my own home is an end table made from 5 cases of trap loads and several pump shotguns in which to fire the shells from. My dog lets me no when things are not right outside.

  26. The legacy of Rooftop Koreans: Look up the meaning of the word: “Saigu” in reference to 4/29/1992. In later years, I purchased myself a single-stack magazine 9mm compact handgun made by Kahr Arms. (later sold to Thompson Center Arms). This gun was designed by a young Korean-American engineering student at MIT that also happened to be a nephew of Rev Sun Yung Moon. He designed his striker fired semiauto handgun for his many friends who were working in the stores, markets and restaurants of their parents. The existing handguns were just too big and bulky to carry all the time and conceal. (so he built one as his senior project at MIT). Many of the businesses that were burned were Korean owned. Some of the lives lost were Korean. Many Koreans dropped out of school to return home to defend their community. To Plainsmedic: Communications were in the form of Radio Korea which used to broadcast in am band. (most LA Koreans were Dodger fans too). Calls for help were relayed through Radio Korea including calls out to former members of the Korean Marines. A good number responded bringing their own long guns, ammo water and food for 72 hrs. The Korean Americans have Saigu. The Japanese Americans have the 442 regimental combat unit during WW2. That is why we helped the Vietnamese community members assimilate to The American Way when they arrived. (send the kids to school and have some guns in the coat closet)

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