PREPS

Anti-Hoarding Laws Will Enable GOV To Take Your Food Storage

government-can-take-your-food

There are laws on the books, right now, that will enable .gov to take and redistribute what you have – as they see fit.

Should those circumstances actually come to pass, government will actually have the legal authority to take what you have.

The mainstream has labeled ‘preppers’ = ‘bad’. Unfortunately their label connotations have ‘stuck’ in the minds of many. Those who are preparedness-minded, independent, liberty-minded, Constitutionalists, gun owners, any of the above… (you get the idea), be aware of your ‘label’ and the anti-hoarding laws which will paint a big target on you…

Note: In the context of this article, “hoarding” is generally what the mainstream refers to preparedness. Things like a deep food pantry, food storage beyond just a few weeks. Extra consumable supplies that you’ve stored, things like that… Common sense preparedness.

So here we go…

How can government actually take away your stored food?

Right now, today, if you’re someone who has ‘prepared’ for disaster, SHTF, or for the seemingly inevitable socioeconomic collapse — you WILL become a target.

Not only those who believe that what’s yours is also theirs, or desperate neighbors or looters, but by your own government. Federal, State, Local, National Guard, even the regular Military… You’re running the risk of having everything taken away from you.

How?

Federal and/or State emergency provisions that are already on the books.

Executive Order – National Defense Resources Preparedness

(Obama) March, 2012.

Pay particular attention to section 801. Definitions.

Sec. 801. Definitions. In addition to the definitions in section 702 of the Act, 50 U.S.C. App. 2152, the following definitions apply throughout this order:

(a) “Civil transportation” —

– includes movement of persons and property by all modes of transportation in interstate, intrastate, or foreign commerce within the United States, its territories and possessions, and the District of Columbia, and related public storage and warehousing, ports, services, equipment and facilities, such as transportation carrier shop and repair facilities.

– also shall include direction, control, and coordination of civil transportation capacity regardless of ownership.

– shall not include transportation owned or controlled by the Department of Defense, use of petroleum and gas pipelines, and coal slurry pipelines used only to supply energy production facilities directly.

(b) “Energy” means all forms of energy including petroleum, gas (both natural and manufactured), electricity, solid fuels (including all forms of coal, coke, coal chemicals, coal liquification, and coal gasification), solar, wind, other types of renewable energy, atomic energy, and the production, conservation, use, control, and distribution (including pipelines) of all of these forms of energy.

(c) “Farm equipment” means equipment, machinery, and repair parts manufactured for use on farms in connection with the production or preparation for market use of food resources.

(d) “Fertilizer” means any product or combination of products that contain one or more of the elements nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium for use as a plant nutrient.

(e) “Food resources” means all commodities and products, (simple, mixed, or compound), or complements to such commodities or products, that are capable of being ingested by either human beings or animals, irrespective of other uses to which such commodities or products may be put, at all stages of processing from the raw commodity to the products thereof in vendible form for human or animal consumption. “Food resources” also means potable water packaged in commercially marketable containers, all starches, sugars, vegetable and animal or marine fats and oils, seed, cotton, hemp, and flax fiber, but does not mean any such material after it loses its identity as an agricultural commodity or agricultural product.

(f) “Food resource facilities” means plants, machinery, vehicles (including on farm), and other facilities required for the production, processing, distribution, and storage (including cold storage) of food resources, and for the domestic distribution of farm equipment and fertilizer (excluding transportation thereof).

(g) “Functions” include powers, duties, authority, responsibilities, and discretion.

(h) “Head of each agency engaged in procurement for the national defense” means the heads of the Departments of State, Justice, the Interior, and Homeland Security, the Office of the Director of National Intelligence, the Central Intelligence Agency, the National Aeronautics and Space Administration, the General Services Administration, and all other agencies with authority delegated under section 201 of this order.

(i) “Health resources” means drugs, biological products, medical devices, materials, facilities, health supplies, services and equipment required to diagnose, mitigate or prevent the impairment of, improve, treat, cure, or restore the physical or mental health conditions of the population.

(j) “National defense” means programs for military and energy production or construction, military or critical infrastructure assistance to any foreign nation, homeland security, stockpiling, space, and any directly related activity. Such term includes emergency preparedness activities conducted pursuant to title VI of the Robert T. Stafford Disaster Relief and Emergency Assistance Act, 42 U.S.C. 5195 et seq., and critical infrastructure protection and restoration.

(k) “Offsets” means compensation practices required as a condition of purchase in either government to government or commercial sales of defense articles and/or defense services as defined by the Arms Export Control Act, 22 U.S.C. 2751 et seq., and the International Traffic in Arms Regulations, 22 C.F.R. 120.1 130.17.

(l) “Special priorities assistance” means action by resource departments to assist with expediting deliveries, placing rated orders, locating suppliers, resolving production or delivery conflicts between various rated orders, addressing problems that arise in the fulfillment of a rated order or other action authorized by a delegated agency, and determining the validity of rated orders.

(m) “Strategic and critical materials” means materials (including energy) that (1) would be needed to supply the military, industrial, and essential civilian needs of the United States during a national emergency, and (2) are not found or produced in the United States in sufficient quantities to meet such need and are vulnerable to the termination or reduction of the availability of the material.

(n) “Water resources” means all usable water, from all sources, within the jurisdiction of the United States, that can be managed, controlled, and allocated to meet emergency requirements, except “water resources” does not include usable water that qualifies as “food resources.”

 
These definitions are written in to the:

1950 War and National Defense Defense Production Act

Go directly to section 2072.

2010 US Code
Title 50 – WAR AND NATIONAL DEFENSE
TITLE 50 – APPENDIX-WAR AND NATIONAL DEFENSE
DEFENSE PRODUCTION ACT OF 1950
Sec. 2072 – Hoarding of designated scarce materials

In order to prevent hoarding, no person shall accumulate:

In order to prevent hoarding, no person shall accumulate:

(1) in excess of the reasonable demands of business, personal, or home consumption, or

(2) for the purpose of resale at prices in excess of prevailing market prices, materials which have been designated by the President as scarce materials or materials the supply of which would be threatened by such accumulation.

The President shall order published in the Federal Register, and in such other manner as he may deem appropriate, every designation of materials the accumulation of which is unlawful and any withdrawal of such designation.

In making such designations the President may prescribe such conditions with respect to the accumulation of materials in excess of the reasonable demands of business, personal, or home consumption as he deems necessary to carry out the objectives of this Act [sections 2061 to 2170, 2171, and 2172 of this Appendix]. This section shall not be construed to limit the authority contained in sections 101 and 704 of this Act [sections 2071 and 2154 of this Appendix].

 
It is clear that the President can decree that having more than (fill in the blank) of food supply (or whatever else) is “in excess of the reasonable demands of business, personal, or home consumption”.

Under what circumstances could this be decreed?

Under a State Of Emergency – or Martial Law.

[ Read: What Would Happen If Martial Law Is Declared? ]

[ Read: Martial Law – Could it Happen Here? ]

I’ll list the pertinent points of Martial Law here:

In strict dictionary terms, martial law is the suspension of civil authority and the imposition of military authority. The military authority under the command of the President will themselves act as the police, as the courts, as the legislature.

What Would Happen Under Martial Law?

U.S. Constitution would be suspended
Suspension of habeas corpus, civil rights, civil law, freedom of the press, assembly, speech
Curfews enforced on the people
Troops in the streets for enforcement
Checkpoints would be set up for control
Ability to hold a person without charge
Potential arrest of anyone who is a ‘suspect’
Imprisonment without representation or due process
Potential house to house confiscation of firearms, ammunition, food supplies (see above)

 
While you might think that a declaration of Martial Law would never happen in the United States (it already has – Lincoln – Civil War), the laws are already on the books just waiting for a proclamation by the President.

Can you think of any ‘triggers’ that would set this train in motion? I sure can…

(( UPDATE: How about the COVID-19 Cornavirus? ))

And the sheeple will be ‘all for it’ because most of them only have a few days of food in their pantry and will want what’s yours… They are counting on it. They are counting on .gov to enforce it. The thing is, it will be legally possible for .gov to do so under declared emergency circumstances.

If you’re a preparedness-minded person who may have a deep food pantry and other such supplies, your risk of confiscation exists. Dependent upon where you live (e.g. population-dense regions), your proximity to military installations, the extent and depth of the ‘circumstance’ itself, and whether or not anyone else already knows about your supply (potential to be ratted out).

How can I avoid government taking my food and supplies?

First and foremost, always keep your mouth shut. OPSEC. Operational Security. If anyone already knows that you’re a (gasp!) ‘prepper’, then simply downplay what you have. You might indicate that you only have a little extra (versus saying many months or more of storage!).

For example if it ever comes up in conversation that you have ‘stuff’, then seize that opportunity to downplay it – deflate what they think you have. It’s sad to even have to discuss this – but it is today’s unfortunate reality.

Don’t put all your eggs in one basket. This means that you might consider spreading around your storage. A little here, a little there. Less obvious. It’s sad to think about this, but it is a potential reality under extreme circumstances. So maybe keep some off site somewhere.

‘If’ you’re home is ever searched, then they will find it. Unless you have very cleverly and effectively hidden your ‘stuff’, it will be discovered. You might consider storing a cache of supplies in another location. Use your imagination. Again, it seems weird having to discuss such things (and some might say paranoid), but it will be a serious consideration for some of you who may be closer to a ‘ground zero’…

Don’t let all your hard efforts go to forcible ‘charity’ (as opposed to that of your free will). While forced redistribution is a form of communism, don’t let yourself be fooled into thinking that it won’t happen…

[ Read: Martial Law Resources: Enough to Control the Population? ]

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I am somewhat confused by the phrase ‘except “water resources” does not include usable water that qualifies as “food resources.”’ But then “food resources” seems to include almost anything ingestible. I have a lot of water stored in 5-liter and 2-liter bottles, and I also have a rain barrel. But the Town tells me that they have an unlimited water supply from their artesian well and a million gallons stored (enough for 550 gallons for each person in the town.) So I think my water is safe.

Most of my packaged food, probably not safe.

I wonder if they will take my stored dog and cat food and kitty litter.

What about my garden? Will they let me keep it, but demand I give them half of whatever I grow?

I have long been more afraid of my government than my neighbors.

I read something recently about Abigail Adams. She was close enough to Breed’s Hill to watch the battle from a hill near her farm. John Quincy Adams was 8 at the time. He wrote about it a few years before his death. After the battle, there were hundreds of refugees from Boston passing near her house, and hundreds of men going the other way to join the militia.

Even though she was alone with no servants (she was an abolitionist) and four children ten and under (John was away serving his country), she fed them and let some of them spend the night, sometimes even several days.

The work was exhausting but she was apparently not afraid of all those strangers in her home. I wonder how safe someone would be letting strangers into her home in these times if there were similar battles close by..

The water pretty much has to be professionally bottled. “Potable water packaged in commercially marketable containers,” although they might deem your water storage “not for human use” and throw it out. Same with food that isn’t professionally packaged. They might not take it, but they could easily decide that it’s unsafe and discard it.

I guess I could tell them my water is for the garden, and the dried beans/corn, etc. are for planting.

“What about my garden? Will they let me keep it, but demand I give them half of whatever I grow?”

they may register it and require you to turn over some percentage of, not what you grow, but rather of what you might be expected to grow. if the situation is very serious they may account for all bare dirt and require the holders to turn over a percentage of whatever might be expected to be grown on such.

Just because it is written in an illegal book doesn’t mean it is law. It did not go through the correct process. It boils down to who has the biggest guns. In any case, don’t be scared, just hide it and only give out what you can afford to give. Leave the junk food loaded with sodium in plain sight, good stuff hidden well and in several locations. Big Kitty litter buckets and paint cans can hide non food items in plain sight.
Today letting strangers in your home is asking for trouble, even certain ‘friends’!

Food? What food? All I have are boxes labeled “Christmas decorations” and “baby clothes”.

Of course, they won’t open any of those boxes to see what is really in them!!

Yep. And they’ll find Christmas decorations and baby clothes. :D

I have them labeled pads and tampons to prevent smelly periods in hot weather….I know this is gross to say here on the blog, but hey, if they want to stick their hands in there….:)

Thank you for that cheerful article Ken. Sure did make my day. Although this info has been out there for a long time, sure makes one wonder what O-bummer (or his controllers) has in store, one stroke of the pen and he’s King and we have absolutely NO rights.
Something to think about, every time you use a CC or a discount card those transactions are recorded, so someone somewhere knows what you have, even if you use cash and a discount card.
Any questions why I don’t trust ANY part of your .gov? Thanks for the reminder though.
NRP

I would like to see them try,,,

In a state of martial law, .gov won’t be the only one who doesn’t follow rules. Obviously, none of us have anything to lose.

If USA suffers an EMP attack, it will be at the hands of our current government.

You can get the discount without signing up for a loyalty card. Just give them “Jenny’s Number” (867-5309) instead of your own phone number. It works in every store, and every in every area code. It works because somebody always registers that number.

“(d) “Fertilizer” means any product or combination of products that contain one or more of the elements nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium for use as a plant nutrient.”

I’d be glad to give them my dog poop decomposing pile and all the fresh dog crap I can shovel at them.

As far as then taking my food or having too much to their ideas during martial law, they will find only a few days supply in or around my home, all cached elsewhere along with extra firearms that somehow was lost years ago in a duck hunting accident.

It would be hard to imagine since there are not enough military to cover the whole country and remote areas to enforce a nationwide curfew especially when people are starving. I have been over this before. Most likely, martial law would refer to a few counties, or a couple cities that were hit with disaster like city riots, hurricane destruction, or like another 9-11 terrorist attack hitting in a certain area.

But if it is an EOTWAWKI event, most of the military would be out for themselves and plundering like looters and murderers, and why I have chosen to live far away from military bases and people.

A free for all in this case states my rights as a human being to fight for survival against such atrocities the military or any civilian population may commit. As I see it, God gave me my rights, not men, and government is to protect those rights not take them away or else that government will be abolished.

As the Declaration of Independence states: “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.”—

Also: “That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.”

I will happily give the gov everything they ask for.. but I will be sure to give them all of my bullets first!

The implementation of martial law in the land would be the most difficult “problem” to deal with in MHO. The confiscation of our food supplies would be devastating to our well being and survival. The thought of government agents pillaging our hard earned food from our home would be a bitter pill to swallow. I see no positive reason to start shooting, you won’t win if the government is beating on your door. I would much rather live to persevere for another day.

We live on a year round stream so water is not a big issue for us, we store some water and have filter abilities. We also have a garden. We also have several garden hoses, handy item.

I feel it is critical to maintain a “gray man” posture. Never be specific to anyone about home canning, food storage or any other supplies you may have set aside NEVER.

If at all possible spread your storage items around your house, garage, shop, barn, chicken coop, root cellar, etc. Be thinking outside the box. I personally do not like the term ” prepper”, as it seems to be synonymous with hoarding. I much prefer the term of “self-reliance”, it is a much more comfortable term, especially for sheeple.

We also don’t purchase any large quantity food items using a credit card or check. A paper trail is so easy to follow.

Yes as Nihilist stated, label boxes with the obvious labels like taxes, family photos, summer clothes, winter clothes, blankets, etc.

Remember to think outside the box and to drink upstream from the herd !

Many Jews, Polls, and Russians never lived to see there second chance arrive. Someone on this site once quoted a Russian who lamented the fact that Stalins henchmen where never beaten back or down, wish I had the reference.

“And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang on the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand? After all, you knew ahead of time that those bluecaps were out at night for no good purpose. And you could be sure ahead of time that you’d be cracking the skull of a cuttthroat.” Alexander Solzhenitsyn, “The Gulag Archipelago.”

Solzhenitsyn was remarkably obtuse to say this. If the resistance he fantasized actually had happened in Leningrad, Stalin simply would have sent the Red Army to level the city and kill everyone in it.

“Never be specific to anyone about home canning, food storage or any other supplies you may have set aside NEVER.”

he said on the internet.

Shhhhhhhhh!!
(Hush!)

Didn’t Jesus tell his Disciples, “Behold, I send you forth as Sheep, in the midst of Wolves; therefore be as wise as a Serpent and as harmless as a Dove.”
Wise words to follow in times such as these.

“as harmless as a Dove”

so you have no guns, then?

don’t answer. I just find it fascinating that so many preppers 1) identify as christians and 2) are armed to the teeth and 3) look to survive in this world rather than the next. not sure how to resolve it myself ….

Jesus also told his disciples to get swords, even if they have to sell their clothes if necessary. Equally important to note is the fact that in Jesus’ time it was ILLEGAL for non-Romans to own swords.

“Jesus also told his disciples to get swords”

… and then told them not to use those swords, and healed the damage done with a sword. honestly, don’t you people even see the text without super-imposing your pre-decided doctrinal positions first?

What if you give them/have out in the open tainted food!!! Oh no please don’t take it its all we have. Hehehe

ok, so you tricked them and handed over tainted food. and if they give it to some starving family and it kills them, that’s their just desserts, yes?

Gman, if they take it from you, I doubt they plan to distribute it to the masses. Most likely to feed the storm troopers.

My late mother was a child and lived on a remote farm during WW2. They were allowed to have x-amount of sugar, salt, pork etc. If anyone was caught with more than the allotted amount there could be severe punishment. She had to laugh because all the farmers and families had supply caches up different creeks and remote locations. This government over reach is nothing new. Enough said!

My mom told me something similar during WW2, but she said it was rationing when people bought certain foods at stores like beef pork poultry, fish, sugar, coffee, flour and canned meats and it was fed to the soldiers, while other things were rationed like rubber tires and copper because it went to the war effort. But that didn’t stop her parents from hunting and fishing, or from having their own garden and fruit trees.

Items like meat, sugar and gasoline were almost universally rationed. I know that in Great Britain the rationing was so strict that people could be jailed for keeping pigs or chickens, but don’t know if it ever got that bad here in the US. Maybe in localized areas where there were shortages. It may have been a matter of rumors saying that these things were illegal without it ever being formalized.

In most places people were encouraged to raise gardens and fruit trees (look up victory gardens) and feed themselves to preserve precious resources for the war effort.

My parents are of the same generation. Their families had gardens and used natural resources around them to save money. Knowing natural foods/medicinal uses for YOUR AREA is crucial information in case confiscation or disaster loses your stock.

Stardust
I have the coupons from WWII when ALL supplies were rationed. My mother used to trade with her neighbor for coupons. The neighbor loved to bake treats and my mom wanted meats an other staples, hence they bargained for what they wanted.

Gasoline, car parts, tires were also a commodity that was rationed, my family owned a gas station with a towing truck serve so they were allowed more coupons than the normal household. Believe it was 5 gallons per month for each household, I would have to look at the coupons again. Oh, before I forget they had a special tag for their vehicles windshields, do not recall what my mother had said but it could be on the tag itself.

If I am not free I am already dead, so come and take what I have when you think it necessary Mr. Government. When those things written about above happen do not think for a second that I would not resist and I have been trained in just the right kind of resistance. Let this be my first and final comment on the subject, Mr. Government.

You also have to worry about the local and state government boys. Find a hole and go black. I think our time is getting short.

You have to worry MOST about local .gov. They are in no way looking out for YOUR interests, and are in no way your friend. The vast majority of county sheriffs are as evil as any other JBT. Trust them at your own peril. The worst killers and looters will wear uniforms.

In Joplin Missouri, the worst looters were said to wear National Guard uniforms.

Hildegard

it is often said that once folks become part of a crowd or organised group, especially with clothing which unites them…uniforms, etc, they take leave of individual thought…

if folks once wore uniforms of a group, they will be called up, and may find it tough to not join up. Besides being obligated to join up, they may find it compelling (as opposed to hiding out etc).

Which is exactly why I’m against uniforms in schools which has become a big trend in our public schools. After all, we wouldn’t want kids growing up thinking their own thoughts, expressing creativity. Best we follow the ideals laid down by the Hitler Youth Program.

Linda S…

Exactly. Well put, to my mind.

I think school uniforms are pretty much geared/intended to sheeple the students. Some will argue that uniforms make life / clothing “more equal”, but, I don’t agree.

I volunteered in Joplin and no one was looting. There was nothing to loot. Everything looked like it was put through a blender. Don’t spread lies.

Last summer I cleaned out my water storage–anything that was leaking or older than 2010 went away. My nieces had a hay-day, throwing those bottles from high places and watching them explode. It occurred to me then that this might easily be the result if someone comes to confiscate my food and finds only home canned and dried produce.

Throw it out, not fit for human consumption. i.e., if we can’t have it no one will. Same with the herb garden–not pharmaceutical grade, rip up the plants. Can’t have a garden, the food isn’t professionally prepared (so we can’t confiscate it). Fruit trees, ditto. It’s one of the reasons that I’m focusing on integrating the trees and herbs into the landscaping.

VERY important article Ken.

I’m unsure if this is huffing & puffing to try and blow the house down or the wicked reality. Most leaders are psychopaths, so I’m on guard for the evil.

My belief is that .gov can’t take away my thoughts, my sentiments, or my soul.

If I go down, it’s with my principles intact.

They just don’t have the manpower to do this… I would like to see them try this in the ghetto’s like S. Central, LA where the would go head to head with the gang bangers…..

They may be their first recruits.

I’m guessing the first recruits will be ex military veterans and / or LEOs. They are already in the system to be sought out for one thing. They already have military experience with weapons and equipment. And they have families, which can be manipulated as leverage for joining the government (join us and your family will be cared for).

Remove these people from the opposing side, gains them flunkies – its a win-win situation.

Gang members are problematic. They might rob from those who feed them too easily. I see gangs becoming protection rackets.

Mack
Then they are dancing with the Devil, and we all know what comes from that.

During WW2 every family was issued ration books for gas and commodities, my father was a farmer so the government purchased all his products and all he used was his gas stamps as he raised all the food on his farm. Today is a different world we live in with corrupt government officials who you can be sure won’t have any shortages themselves.

This is what I see as the biggest possibility, ration stamps again, the violence of trying to confiscate might be overwhelming. But that is just a guess.

Put nothing past any level of Government. It’s just another group of people when things go sideways. The mob, any kind of mob, will come up with some cover story to justify taking what they want.

Robert A. Heinlein said Man is not a rational animal, he is a rationalizing animal. I guess you have to buy as much ammo as you do something to eat. If you have a tribe sized group that you hide remotely with in a place where you can grow your own… that’s as good as you can do, I guess. Next election may make all the difference!

If there is a next election, and I’m betting if there is it wont be a pretty outcome.

Sure go ahead and take my food. I can’t remember which boxes I poisoned anyway. I’ve been too afraid to touch the stuff myself.

It’s not a matter of them taking your food for consumption. They will easily and effortlessly discard all of your preps and never look back. The confiscators could care less what happens after they take it from you: they just don’t won’t you to have it. thanks

Pay cash for whatever you buy.
Buy local, so no shipping labels.
Keep your mouth shut— OPSEC, above all.

We are circling the drain folks, it is time.

The talk about the constitution and all our rights will not mean a thing when they are suspended!

I wonder if they remember when I Volunteered to fight their war over seas. Do they not think I will fight for my family in my home? They forget so soon how many of us have been trained to fight. They can have everything I own/have when I run out of bullets. Come and get it.

This is exactly why returning veterans are considered a threat, along with teabaggers and other “radical” conservative groups.

Thank you very much for your service!

Same here, except the part about them having anything, they can sift through the ashes and that goes for anyone else thinking about taking what I have worked hard for.
No free rides…

Amen, brother. I enlisted for Vietnam and Infantry. I am almost 70 and I guarantee I have not lost what I learned.

heh. it’s one thing to storm into someone else’s family home, threaten their family, when yours is back home and untouchable in another country. it’s quite another thing when your own family is standing right behind you and is in the line of fire.

would you fight in such circumstances?

did any of your opponents fight in such circumstances?

I would think the gov’t playbook for this will be to start where the largest quantities of undistributed food are first. Assuming all stores are picked clean, it seems likely they would start with the biggest targets: warehouses, distribution centers, storage silos, factories, and packaging plants along with farms, orchards, dairies, and other large-scale facilities.

I would hope it would take a little bit of time before individual homes would be targeted, with those most difficult to reach (rural, remote, etc…) last to be considered.

I agree with Ken that location will make a big difference. Those in urban and suburban population centers, or near military installations would get first attention, those in remote areas with low population levels would likely have more time.

I agree with NRP, not exactly a cheery post… and I have been thinking about alternatives all day. I need the world to hold it together a while longer so we can retire and get the heck out of Dodge! Since wishful thinking is not a good plan, I have to continue to consider alternatives. Sigh!

bingo. the government will never come for your food. by the time anyone is coming for your food, there will be no government, just gangs and mafia and rawles’ “individual man with 30 days of food and a gun”.

“from my cold dead hands.” yep, that’s what will happen.

So Cal Gal,

I was thinking the same thing. These laws were originally written to allow government to confiscate large cashes of good from farms and warehouses. The government is not going to to door-to-door examining everyone’s pantry. This would not be an effective use of the national guard and it would be contrary to social distancing mandates.

Having thought about all the money and hard work to build a deep larder, has anyone considered booby trapping their supplies as in the book “The Patriots” by J W Rawles?

Way beyond thinking about it…

heh. they’ll just tell YOU to bring it all out.

When they come I will be ready, if I cant have it
N O B O D Y CAN.
Big badaboom

I used to have a garden… now it’s just filled with weeds. Some of them are pretty tasty; others are quite deadly. Don’t rush me, or I might get them confused….

Please, I am one that is prepared and I believe I am. This article shows that the government has all this crap in writing on the book but seriously there is NO way in hell they can enforce this BS.

There is not enough personnel to go house to house or whatever it will take to attempt to enforce it. It is ridiculous to think that they can. There is a lot more to be concerned about than this stupid theory.

JCB, and you are right about the personnel strength. Many will now side with any unlawful order. There are some, yep, but most won’t.

There will be “international assistance” to what ever traitors turn on the population.They are already in place, kept in rotation as receiving training…

If anyone wants to get an idea of the procedures for the upcoming times, search for the field manual for psychological operations. When you do find it, take the time to read it.
Also look for the manuals for Civil Affairs ( Army )… now those are interesting….

Found them both immediately (which is rather ironic considering the warnings about classification on the first page)

Taxas
Are you referring to the Civilian/PSYOP on the SF page?

AC,

yes and no. I have not gone to ASOCs page lately, I have had these manuals for a while as a PDF and hard copy.

All I can say is the fact that these are out there for everyone to download, it means that the folks over at these branches are on our side.
These field manuals really do explain much of what will happen. Read them. These are for me a must read if you want to know how uncle sam will take steps. Having them out in the public, it is a heads up to the public to give everyone an edge.
When SHTF, psyops will be the thing on the gov side.

Civil Affairs and Psy Ops are Army Reserve, there is only one group and one command on the active duty side for the Army. The Marines have CA and PsyOps now too which work with the Marine Expeditionary Command. CAPOC, as the branch is called, is part of the Reserve Command, but used to be under Army SOC till October 1 2006. SF is part too, but they are SF, just like the Rangers and Delta.

Hi all. Haven’t posted much lately but have been checking in reading the posts and comments.

These are uncomfortable topics but we must address them and come to terms with our personal plans to deal with them. I personally believe the EVIL EMPIRE IN DC. are capable of just about anything now. To under estimate their ruthlessness is a fatal error on our part. This is just one more thing to prepare for.

They will make examples out of a few to get most people to fall in line. Many will cave in, many will become informers against others.

(China, Russia, Vietnam, Laos, Germany used or currently using these tactics.) Look how they are picking up people from The Bundy ranch. Barely a whisper from any one.(NAZI GESTAPO TACTICS.)

I believe we have a better chance if it is a fast collapse rather than a slow spiral.Gives them less time to act.

Me? I’m standing and fighting. They can only kill me. They can’t take away my beliefs or what is in my Heart. I’m with Kulafarmer. Don’t leave nothing for these Dinks!

I only hope I live the last few minutes of my life well. On my feet, facing these SOB’s ventilating as many as I can before I drop…

I really hope that traitor gets out of the WH before anything major happens. And I also hope the next President takes this crap off the books!
I can hope.
My goodness, how the Founding Fathers of this Nation must be rolling over in their graves!!

Let me ask you this – What local politicians do you think are preppers and preparing themselves & family? … most likely none …. same same across the board with the business owners, civic leaders, powerbrokers, religious clergy and the LEOs …

Your confiscation problem won’t be with the Feds or on a State level – if your OPSEC has been a failure – expect a knock on the door to start – and a kick to follow ….

I have actually heard a Texas preacher tell his congregation to start storing food & water for at least 6 weeks on international TV/Internet. He stressed to do it before this fall, 2016

garden doing good. tomato plant loaded along with squash & cucumber. had very bad storm tonight–but went out & garden okay. maple tree fell on a car out front. wish i could plant some fruit trees but Rachael ray said her trees took 3 yrs to produce. so got to wait until i move to country before planting those.

honeymom

what you could consider doing is,
keep your eyes peeled for end of the season clearance on fruit trees/shrubs…ex…blueberry, cherry, haskap, gooseberry etc..

sometimes when they are ready to close, even if they are very discounted, they will give you a huge discount if you take a bunch. Especially if they are looking wilted and dried out.

You can get them now, and keep them in the pots, making sure to fertilize and water.

That way, when you get your land, you’ll have some cheap shrubs to plant.

I have gotten a few this way, from one to five dollars.

IF they THEY being the feds i will NOT just roll over and let em take everything i WILL NOT GO ALONE I WILL STAND AND FIGHT

My suggestion is… If you are in a large city – get out. Don’t pay with debit/credit cards when buying large quantities of stuff. Pay cash. Grow your gardens, and prune your orchards. I don’t think they will be coming after such veggies/fruit. If you have hens, and you sell eggs… and you have a sign up – take it down. If you already have a list of people that rely on your eggs – they know you have them, and that’s ok. I don’t think I would advertise anymore other than word of mouth. Teach others how to grow a garden, and the importance of Heirloom seeds. If you teach people with enthusiasm on growing their own food, chances are, they won’t steal yours. My Mum and Aunts used to giggle about the rationing during WWII – not that it was a joking matter, but, the concept. Yes, they did have either ration stamp book. My one Aunt didnt smoke cigarettes (or anything for that matter) but, my Mum and her neighbor did. When it came time to fetch their cigarettes, they made my Aunt get her share. Aunt said “But, I don’t smoke!” my Mum said “But you do this week!” haha… there is always a way. So Mum and her neighbor shared Auntie’s cigarettes… They all lived through the hard times of WWII by sharing, gardening, etc. No one in our country really wants STHTF, But, if/when it does – be wise. Don’t make your neighbors your enemies… it could be devastating. There was a movie made in Ireland (One Hundred Days) Its a simple movie of a SHTF scenario. Many Many holes in the movie. I don’t know the point other than for all of us to point out when each person did wrong, and to learn from it… or maybe it was meant to teach people how to prepare. None the less, there are lessons to be learned. Like I said – try to teach. Maybe take an established tomato plant in a container to someone to get their feet wet. Kids LOVE to learn. Hands on is the best way IMHO. My gradeschool teacher taught us how to sprout seeds, and grow veggies – Probably science class in elementary school. I grew a tomato plant – Dad gave me three seeds to take to school. I brought home my little tomato plant in a cup the last day of school. Dad put it in the garden with the rest of his starts…. I watched the whole garden grow all summer long, and I was interested since I had a “hand” in it (not to mention weeding **Sigh**) I can’t ever talk enough about teaching people things. If you teach people, maybe they will come to you for help with a task, instead of in the night trying to steal what you have worked so hard for. Torino – That movie comes to mind. Clint Eastwood. If we don’t educate, and we “hoard” all the… Read more »

Youngest of 3, So true. All great points!

@ Youngest of 3
Being the youngest of 3 also your post hit home quite a bit. My parents also went through the depression; my Father fought in WWII and was gone for 2.5-3 years. I heard many of many of stories of what they did to survive those times. I will never forget the pride in my Fathers eyes when he would teach and tell me about hundreds of things they did to “make it through”. Admittedly sometimes maybe not the best of student, but.

Your story about the 3 seeds and the tomato plant, it was always amazing to me how “my” tomato plant was always the one that grew the tallest and produced the most fruit….. Fathers are that way ya know??? One thing, How was it my Father was so dumb when I was 18 and became the smartest man in the entire world when I hit 23???? Sure do miss that old fart.

I believe that’s way so many of us “crazy’s” here are such fans of Ken’s Blog. This is a place to learn, gather ideas and share topics, along with all the Bitc#ing, Moaning and Complaining we/I do, well you all do cause I never have a cross word to say about anything HAHAHAHA

You have a GREAT attitude Youngest of 3, don’t ever lose that.
NRP

Thank You NRP. I am not a teacher by trade, but, I have the heart of a teacher.

Before I start let me address an item many read but did not comprehend at the very beginning.

**SECTION 801 number (a): “Civil Transportation- Includes movement of persons and property by all modes of transportation.”**

Yes, it means that they can physically remove you from your home, take your belongs, and YOU have absolutely nothing…..nothing so say about it, while they raid your home to remove whatever the .gov believes they need or belongs to them. Welcome to the peasant/slave/peon order in this nation under martial law.
It was also brought up in the series of books by A. American.

Such a good article it was shipped to relatives who are on the same wave link as many on this site.

Those of us on the other side of 60 will be likely be eliminated due to age and health concerns. Even though we will be the ones with knowledge. Reminds me of the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia also known as the “KILLING FIELDS”. If you are unaware of the history I suggest you look it up, and be prepared.

@ antique collector
Yep, to all of the above, makes one wonder what we/you are willing to die for and how far can one go to drive home that reality. I do not believe that if/when the .gov/O-bummer, declares Martial Law they think it will go softly as one might think, there are a LOT of Billy-Bob’s out there with their squirrel riffles that may look unkindly to some POS Brown Shirt busting down their door to “take” what they want.
FYI in 2016 there were over 23 million FBI Background Checks for buying firearms, figuring that at least 20,000,000 of those were for a sale. I would say the odds are not really good for a Martial Law takeover. As someone once told me, don’t mess with Grandma’s bean pot unless you want to get burned. Ever seen a Riot overrun the Police and NG? People have had their fill of the .gov, why do you think Trump is doing so well? His charming personality HAHAHAHA
As far as “physically remove you from your home” as a friend once said “better bring a few body bags ya think?” and he is/was a LEO
Not that I would ever condone violence;
But you know me, Just thinking what could ever go wrong?
NRP-Other-Side-Of-60

NRP
Hope this nut does not fall to far from the tree of liberty as my 9th/10th grt grandfathers family placed a lot on the line to jump start this country. Yes, we have Torries(modern day socialist)in the family, must be related to the milk man. :-)

There is perpetrating violence on another unjustly and there is using extreme violence to defend yourself or others. The comand was not to murder. Violence for defense as last resort was just that justified defense.
Considering natrual resources we are overlooking one big dog in the corner. They are using the tree hugger laws to constrict the population already. I feel certain part of this emergency will prohibit hunting fishing and improper appropriation of water resources. Just another tool in their bag to control and winnow those who wish to stand apart down.

I just recently moved to another state and that gave us an opportunity to do a “Do Over” on OPSEC. We numbered and lettered all of the boxes and kept a record of each box and it’s contents. That kept anyone who helped load the trucks from knowing the contents. On a few trips I made them by myself because of the nature of the items being moved.
I say this just in case anyone is in the process of moving and needs to have a clean slate.
OPSEC is very difficult to maintain. Once it’s breached it’s like trying to stuff all of that noise back down the barrel after pulling the trigger.

@ Danny Lee
Extremely smart move. Unless you happened to move to California?
NRP

§2166. Termination of Act

(a) Title I [sections 2071 to 2078 of this Appendix] (except section 104 [section 2074 of this Appendix]), title III [sections 2091 to 2094 of this Appendix], and title VII [sections 2151 to 2170, 2171, and 2172 of this Appendix] (except sections 707, 708, and 721 [sections 2157, 2158, and 2170 of this Appendix]) shall terminate on September 30, 2014, except that all authority extended under title III on or after the date of enactment of the Defense Production Act Reauthorization of 2009 [Sept. 30, 2009] shall be effective for any fiscal year only to such extent or in such amounts as are provided in advance in appropriations Acts.

Dobbs: “If you’re the police, then where are your badges?”
Gold Hat: “Badges? We ain’t got no badges. We don’t need no badges. I don’t have to show you any stinkin’ badges!”

I think that the O’Bozo gubberment would have a difficult time trying to enact anything close to a seizure order in Utah, with the Mormons and the LDS Church. Most everyone I know makes, bakes, sews, cans, preserves, gardens, and has guns and ammunition. Members have been taught (indoctrinated?) about preparing and setting aside for that proverbial “rainy day”, be it personal (loss of job), or nationwide (depression?). So, it’s an open not-so-secret that EVERYONE around here prepares. Even non-LDS people prepare. It’s more unusual to find anyone that DOESN’T prepare.

So, is the US Damned Guberment going to seize the entire state of Utah? ANd NOT expect any repercussions and blowbacks?

A friend once told me that during the war (which war?) that commercially packaged foods were confiscated, but not home-canned products. She also said there was a shortage of canning jar lids because all the metal was used toward the war effort. For whatever it’s worth:)

if you’re one of the people that grabbed all the alcohol off the shelves and for gods sake, toilet paper…really??? you are not “preparing” – you are hoarding and you are keeping people who need a few bottles of alcohol to actually survive this from having what they need becausae you want so much more..you want to feel safe from everything and you’re not and you’ll never be. You think you are entitled and that might makes right. What really kills me is that most of you call yourselves Christian. Now, if you’re one that long ago laid aside a year’s worth of what you might need in an emergency …that’s understandable…that would be being prepared.and kudos to you and you would not be considered hoarders. ..but going out at the beginning of a crisis and buying WAY more than you’ll ever need of what EVERYONE needs…so you have more than you need and everyone else has none. THAT’s hoarding and you deserve the bottom rung of hell.

PO’d old lady with a sick husband who needs a LITTLE extra sanitizer and can’t get it.;

I will bet you $$$ to Doughnuts that 99% of the good folks here will agree 1000% with you.

Lolady,
👍

CR

NRP,
Oh well, can’t win ’em all 😯
I think that she’s on the wrong site, as folks like on this, and similar sites, prepare over time and are not the typical panicked hoarders.
Wonder what led her here?
At least A/C gave her a good idea where to look.

How about you should take responsibility for your own lack of preparedness?
I doubt anyone here ran to the store and bought up cases and cases of anything…
But hey, progressives and other mental midgets love blaming everyone else for their own failings,,,,

Po’d,

You are preaching to the choir, we understand. For years many of us, so called “preppers” , have been equated with “Hoarders”. Nope. Most of us built up our stores slow over time, when there was an abundance of products. What you are seeing are those who have laughed at preppers for years now going full blown PANIC, and hoarding. Sorry you could not find alcohol for your husband. Maybe you can find a liquor store and by 195 proof “Everclear” grain alcohol, it will do in a pinch.

PO’d old lady:

Holster your broad brush and stand down. I cannot tolerate crowds (or most people) for longer than a few seconds. I’ve even taken the long way home off the freeway at night so as not to even have to LOOK at the stupid, throngs of base, feeble-minded idiots who suddenly realized they aren’t prepared for life.
Chill with all the “you- you- you” stuff. You don’t know any of us!

I usually don’t reply to stupid post like this, but I’m gonna reply to this one, because it pisses me off.

YOU, YOU, YOU, I’m not YOU. I’m not the one who knew my sick husband needed hand sanitizer, and didn’t prepare. I’m not the one, who’s at the store right now, panicking.

“you have more than you need and everyone else has none. THAT’s hoarding and you deserve the bottom rung of hell.”

YES, I have more than I need. I do not give a damn about all you fools who did not prepare. I stocked my self, with preps, it took me 40 yrs to get where I’m at. You wanna stand on your soap box, and cry, because you didn’t prepare, and then tell me to rot in hell.?!!!!!!!!

Does this mean anything to you. ” It is easier to take the cubs away from a mother bear, than it is to get a FOOL to admit the folly.!!!!

You made the mistakes, take responsibility, we preppers did .!!!!

PO’d old lady,

Curious. Did your sick husband (or for that matter, you and other loved ones) just now develop a need for hand sanitizer? I ask, because we have always kept it on hand. We didn’t develop a sudden need due to the coronavirus. We picked up a half gallon jug for refilling the smaller dispensers we keep in all our vehicles, the kitchen, and bath. As luck would have it, we picked up that jug a week before the rest of the world decided they needed it, all it would seem, at the same time. Funny thing, I believe we gave south of $5 for that half gallon jug, figured it to last us a year. Suddenly it has become gold, but I bought it because it serves a purpose and was cheaper in the larger size.

Same with food and other necessities. Those things that have a decent shelf life, we buy in bulk, especially when it’s on sale, replace it as we use it, just to maintain a cushion, not to horde. Really not that much different than a savings account.

Surprisingly, we also use toilet paper. I guess we are odd, because we tend to keep extra in the store room, so that we don’t have to run to the store to buy a roll when the one on the holder runs out. We tend to buy bulk when we buy. Much cheaper that way, plus we have the peace of mind knowing we don’t have to panic when the store might be sold out.

Join us in our quest to not be a burden on others, but rather to be self sufficient and hopefully….prepared for the unexpected……like going to the store and finding an empty shelf where what you wanted used to be.

PO’d
Who are you?
Never heard from you before.
Begone before someone drops a house on you too.
PS. I call myself a Jew.
MadFab

PO’d
If ya didn’t get the reference, I was calling you the wicked witch
MadFab

Wow, PO’d old lady. I feel sorry for your husband that you didn’t have the foresight to be prepared. The people emptying the shelves are the unprepared just like you. So instead you go to the store during the height of the Pandemic like all the other sheep. Now if you picked up the virus and brought it home, you most likely can blame yourself if your husband gets it and dies.
Unlike you, I am well prepared and have not entered a store in about a month.

Ding-Ding-Ding! We have winner in Round 3, ‘Peanut’ over ‘PO’d old lady’ by TKO, let’s hear it for Peanut! (Crowd Roars). Seriously Peanut, I wish I would have responded to our visiting professional victim that succinctly and on point.

Thanks tmcgyver, some people you just want to wring their necks.

Po’ed old lady,

I am not PO’ed because hand sanitizer or alcohol was out at the stores when I looked for it. Instead of complaining, use SOAP and WATER or Clorox clean up wipes. You have brains, so use it.

PO’d Old Lady, we agree with you. we have little respect for the idiots who went out and purchased cases of TP, there are other options. I am moving this part to the Open forum.

Dear Woman, (P.O.’d Lady) I and others here understand you fear and anger at what is happening. If we may, can we pray for you and your ill spouse, please!

God bless you both

PO lady with sick husband, first: I’m sorry to hear your husband is ill and we will pray for you. Second: no, I am not one of those that has to hit the store because we felt something like this could happen and started preparing more seriously almost ten years ago. Before that time, I always kept extra of everything in my home so I could manage two or three months with no problem…I have always done that. Third, if others had managed their homes a little better and kept a good supply of everything on hand, they would not need to panic buy now.

I am truly sorry that you don’t have what you need, but those on this site aren’t the ones to whom you should direct your anger. This is a good site if you want to learn how to possibly keep yourself and your spouse safer/fed/healthier/less stressed than you might otherwise.

Peace be with you.

PO’d lady
Apparently you missed the posting I placed for those looking for SANITZIER but there is non available.

Go on line an look for [Hand Cleanser], then check out the ingredients.

FDA will not let the small business use the title “”sanitizer”” since they did not inspect it, nor collect additional monies from a small business person working from their homes trying to make extra money from their hard endeavors.

At least this way you will have what you are looking for, just because it is not on the shelf in your stores does not mean it is not available.

I bought it all-ALL-ALL-ALL I TELL YOU, now I have multiple warehouses filled with EVERYTHING I need FOREVER! Haaaaaaaaaaa!

One of my favorite scripture verses, ” What good does it do a person if they gain the whole world, but lose their soul”?

I am a child of God, my Father is a good God and He will take care of me, so if the Feds need some stuff, I will share with those who need help. As the Apostle Paul wrote, the Cross is foolishness to those of this world, so call me foolish, I wear the word with pride.

Seminole Wind,
👍👍

Not even reaading thru the article or comments.

Cold dead hands.

I’ve taken precautionary measure. I’ve been taxed
And taxed again for what I have.
I will NEVER just hand over what I ‘ve struggled for to those that want to possess what is mine.. never.
If it comes to my front porch, so be it.
Blood will be spilled.
Sayith, i.
And bet your sweet ass on that one

Yup,
Same here JC
I worked for everything i have, it aint much but its mine.
They can have the lead then the ashes

Kula
Do you have extra chairs or shall I bring my own?

Shall I bring more butter needed for the theatrical popcorn show?

Gawd.i need a shower, a movie and supper…
a smoke and a beet…..I guess a beer may be good, too.
Beer, beet what have ya.
Stay safe during these times, bra.
Bra means bro, right?

Just wanna be PC
(Online hugs and elbow bumps)

I find the elbow-bump thing quite entertaining, considering that people are being told to sneeze into their elbow…

I absolutely agree! Yet they made fun of Pelosi for suggesting people bow which can be done from 6 feet away. when you think about it, it does make sense.

Personally I miss the old days when if you shook hands it was a done deal. Honor was so important and no one would dishonor their word.

The other day a patient / friend of mine greeted me with a Yoga bow and said “Namaste away from you” (Now I’m stay’n away from you). I’m doing that now.
Beach’n

While it makes for a great article, the seizure of food in possession of American citizens is logistically impractical. The manpower and fuel necessary to carry out house to house searches would far exceed the capabilities of the military and all civilian law enforcement combined, who would already be distracted by other missions such as maintaining order. If you were to deployed everyone to the task of house to house searches, it could take a year or more to complete, by which time most food stored in homes would long since be gone. So, bottom line, its not going to happen.
The biggest threat may come from neighbors and criminal gangs conducting home invasions while law enforcement is distracted elsewhere.
The government will move to limit and control all future distribution of supplies, much easier task. They will limit how much you can received, like a lot of stores are already doing.
So, fear a little less your supplies are safe from the government, its your lazy son-in-law that will be the problem!!!

Yep, making declarations are one thing, enforcement is another!

I believe the possibility is there for confiscation because it was enacted into law to do so. But I also believe they will reach for the low grapes first. That means controlling large targets (Manufacturers/producers and distributors) first. But I also believe if you are in an area that is being enforced by guard units, etc., there is a risk if this thing runs long term, they will need to feed their men and some of those possibly could bully for what they want (not need). That includes more than food and supplies.

I also believe we will have the pull from those in need that we won’t be able to ignore….and it will mean less for our family because others failed to prepare. But I also know the difference between a need and a want.

And there are always people willing to steal what you have…even in good times. Those should beware because they will not be tolerated.

Food confiscation from individual homes is highly unlikely in my opinion. Way too many drawbacks. The price to the confiscators way too high for the returns.

If this present unpleasantness goes for an extended period, if food and necessities become scarce, if folks become desperate (I believe that scenario is possible, darn well wouldn’t bet my family’s well being against it), I would be more concerned with some folks representing themselves as government agents ordered to take your supplies.

True the biggest threat if the country collapse’s government will be very limited if any at all anarchy will rule 50 million minimum dead county will never be the same the country will break into section ruled by the strongest Government will not be able to contain it.

Good luck confiscating peoples food they don’t have enough people to do it for one your crazy to think military will help them all that wiil happen is those trying to take it will need body bags there are lots of communities out here that are already prepared to take down government if they over step their given authority remember there are 140 million registered gun owners in this country

I’ve read every word of this post yet did not see at any time words authorizing confiscation of anything. What am I missing?

then they had better be ready to eliminate a LOT of people