The Greatest Depression Is Coming | What It Will Be Like

The Greatest Depression is going to be so bad, it will shock the world. It’s not going to be ‘just’ here in the U.S., it will be global. The systemic risk is entirely global.

It’s a intertwined global systemic problem. The Global Debt Bubble is currently more than $250 Trillion (2018 numbers). Likely approaching $300 Trillion today. I’ve read that 30 Central Banks have lowered their interest rates this year. Most all rates are now NEGATIVE. In other words, you buy bonds and when they mature you get less money back than you put in. Crazy. And the U.S. doesn’t have much room left for their own rates… The equity market is one giant bubble. Low interest rates (cheap money) has been the compressed-air, but reality is going to be the pin that pops it. At this point there’s no way out. It’s a mathematical certainty that it’s going to blow apart.

The Greatest Depression | How Does That Look?

It won’t look like the Great Depression of the 1930’s. No. Instead it’s going to be worse. First and foremost, the people and their way of life was quite different back then. Moral character was much higher. Many were farmers to one extent or another. A much higher percentage were self reliant. Family units were intact. Citizens did not hate their own country. Most people could ‘work’ with their hands. They had more practical skills. We made things back then. We were not reliant on imports as we are today.

I’m certain that most of you understand the major differences between then and now, and how those differences are going to make it much worse this time around.

Job & Income Loss

When it crashes, will the company you work for be able to stay in business? The people who are in sectors which are not closely tied to the necessities of daily living, will be hurt the most. Businesses will go out of business. Other businesses will trim, cut, and lay off workers in order to survive. When currency becomes worth less and income is not keeping up with its devaluation, consumers afford less, buy less. When there’s none to be had, consumers buy nothing. A chain reaction takes place all the way from local to global. When this gigantic historic bubble bursts, it’s not going to be a recession. The effects will devastate or eliminate people’s disposable income. Game over. Greatest Depression.

Government (non)Assistance

The government will have great difficulty keeping the masses from revolt. Why? Because they won’t be able to just give more (worth less) money handouts to so many people with the same effectiveness. When they start doing that, it’s going to go hyper-inflation. The tipping point for chaos and revolt is when a tipping point of people are without jobs, desperate and hungry. And that’s what’s going to happen.

Surviving on Less

The initial shock is going to be extreme for those who have had it all, but having been participating in the (fake) bubble. Most people who believe they’re living large, are actually living on debt. Those people will be stunned into a new reality. And it’s not going to be pretty.

Everyone will be forced to live on less. The relative cost of goods will be enormous while there will be little money to be had. Lots more people will be eating Rice and Beans, for example.

There will be less or none of just about everything. It’s almost unimaginable, given the cushy lifestyle that most enjoy today.

How Many Will Lose Their Homes

This one is interesting. In theory, most everyone who defaults on their mortgage payments would lose their homes to the bank. During the 1930’s many lost their homes and farms. There’s also the issue of non payment of property taxes. However in a Greatest Depression during modern times, I suspect that conditions might be so bad, that there will be no way to enforce this en masse. In the beginning perhaps, but this may decay rapidly into a total meltdown of modern civilization as we know it. The real problems are instead going to be food, infrastructure, and security.

Cities Will Meltdown

Imagine the hundreds of thousands to millions who live in the city regions dotted around this nation. Now imagine so many of them without enough money to buy what they need. It’s going to be chaos. Do you really think that the trucks will keep rolling down the highways feeding the city regions with enough or any of the consumables they need to survive? Will city managers and political systems (local/state/federal) be able to maintain a control over adequate distribution into these regions? Perhaps some, but certainly not all (or maybe not many at all).

Infrastructure Breakdown

To varying extents, there will be crumbling infrastructure. People literally cannot survive in population dense regions without functional critical infrastructure. Major efforts will be in place to keep this running. However one wonders how many will stay on their jobs if their pay is or has essentially become “monopoly money”. What incentive will there be? Will they not be more concerned about their own family security?

Survival Will Be About Your Own Abilities

The Greatest Depression will literally be about one’s own abilities to survive. Self reliance will be of the highest order. But how many people today are even fractionally self reliant? We are a people who are nearly entirely dependent. How’s that going to work out?

Migration To Where’s There’s Work

During the Great Depression of the 1930’s, there was extensive migration of people looking for work, for a way to survive. Today though, I do not believe this will be even remotely similar. Why? Because most people today cannot do anything practical with their hands. Most people do not have practical skills of the trades. For most, in my estimation, there will be little paying work to be had in their fields of expertise compared to before the Greatest Depression.

BugOut Desperation

On the other hand, if it’s bad enough that people are literally dying in the cities (for example), or anywhere else, some of these people will desperately try to get out. To bugout to somewhere with greener pastures. I don’t know how many. Some feel this will be incredible hordes of people. I’m not so sure, given the ingrained notion that they will somehow be saved where they’re at (by government). But surely there will be a significant attempt to get out, to go where there might be food, farms, to areas they believe can support them in some way.

Security and Safety

I do strongly believe that a Greatest Depression in today’s climate will rapidly boil into major personal and home security issues. The percentage of people who have a realistic ability to take care of themselves or to be self reliant is so small, that this will erupt into social chaos and breakdown of civility in many areas. It will be a time of incredible dangers.

Government Enforcement

When things get really bad, it will become difficult for governments to keep control. It will be a shear numbers problem. Even if the government mandates things like distribution escorts, mandatory restrictions, required work force, enforcing the law or new law… how will they enforce it all across the nation? Answer: they can’t. There will be too many people in desperate straits.

So, what will it really be like?

None of us lived through the Great Depression. We can only read about it. I just know how very, very different it is today than back in the 1930’s. It makes me think that the next one is going to be so very much worse. I don’t even like to think about it. I absolutely and certainly hope that it never happens. However I really do believe that this horrible thing is getting closer. I see signs out there. I hear the waterfall up ahead. I’m not ready for it. But who actually is?

Power seeks a vacuum. What changes will happen geopolitically because of this? What entities will take advantage of the situation? And in what way? How many will lose their lives in this disaster?

It helps to vocalize questions. To offer opinions. To rationalize logical scenarios. While also realizing that some things don’t work out logically. I’ve reached a rambling 1700 words. I could go on for thousands more. But I’ll turn over the discussion to you.

What will it be like?

I did not originate the phrase “Greatest Depression”. I’ve heard it before. Most recently from Gerald Celente of Trends Research. Though it rings true indeed.

Continue reading: Lessons Learned from the Great Depression

Survival Skills from the Great Depression


  1. In my humble opinion, it will be utter chaos. The cities will burn, figuratively and then literally.
    The .gov will have little or no control, the country will fracture into various segments, some possibly as large as multiple states, especially in flyover country. Cities will be run by various “warlords”, think Mogadishu…it will be brutal and fast. You will likely have what you have when it hits. Security will be difficult at best, probably impossible in urban areas, the trouble will spread from the cities to the suburbs rather quickly…it will slowly permeate the rural areas, once people out there can’t feed themselves and their children, it will be just as ugly as the cities. Raiding parties, hasty fortifications, it is going suck hard…I pray it holds together another 20 years, I would like to miss it, but I rather doubt I will.

      1. No offense Brother but you swiped my handle !! Yours in Faith and Liberty, FN, DB.

    1. Do a search on ‘how many people died during the 1929 depression’ I use duckduckgo because it gets my search request typically on the first page. The results did not indicate the chaos and horror that people talk about. For the most part, day workers will increase a lot and food will take up most of the salary. And people will be living in simple situations.

      1. This might be true if we were living in 1929 but if/when we enter a new Great Depression it is going to be an entirely different animal. As stated in the above article, people in 1929 were for the most part self sufficient vs people today who are so use to the “just in time” delivery of groceries to stores. If the economy crashes and trucks/trains stop running or at best slow down deliveries, these people will panic. Many (probably most) don’t know how to grow their own food. Many think that they can just run down to the store and buy seeds and stick them in the ground and they will have food. They are so disconnected from where it all comes from and how to grow their own. Even if the trucks don’t stop or slow down, we’ve just gone through a very bad growing season. Foods prices are going to go up and food availability is going to go down over the coming months/year. If we have a bad season next spring/summer, it won’t get any better any time soon.
        Maybe it won’t be Armageddon like some people think, but it is definitely going to be worse than the 1929 depression in many ways…especially in the big cities.

      2. That is NOT TRUE at all.
        10 MILLION Americans died of starvation between 1929 and 1939.
        10% of the population or 1% a year for 10 years.
        THAT was when 70% of Americans LIVED ON FARMS.
        (They didn’t starve)..
        So..1 in 3 of the Americans NOT LIVING ON FARMS DIED.
        It will be MUCH WORSE this time around as most Americans in 1929 KNEW WHAT BATHROOM TO USE.


        1. Agree with Gunny. All one needs to do is look at the panic and chaos that hits people when a large storm is predicted (snow/Hurricane). Store shelves are bare within hours, and we all know of those folks (seems like more all the time) that barely have a can of soup in the house on a regular basis, as they always eat out or have delivery…
          Those of us who are “more seasoned” remember our mom’s ALWAYS having a large very well stocked larder, with lot’s of home canned items, plus our large home gardens and game we brought home from hunting. How many folks have those items now? Back in the 50-60’s those things were still common and you were not thought of as a “survivalist” ….
          I find that many (not all of course) of the younger generations have a reason for not having a food stock…… they don’t know how to cook or prepare a meal! So how do they survive when it hits?….. Oh that’s right….. find a “safe space”.

        2. Don’t mock the younger generation for what they don’t know. Instead, call into accountability those who have not taught them!

        3. @LEO , funny you should mentiong those who eat out or have delivery. My daughter and her husband eat out all the time and when they don’t they get those meals that are delivered but have to be cooked. They are very well off, but never have much of anything in the house as far as food. I on the other hand have much stored food and always keep my pantry full, in addition to emergency supplies. I worry about what will happen when they all come to ME when the SHTF. Of course I will help my family, but with the money and space they have, they could store enough for a year!

        4. Linda S
          The children have opportunity to learn for them self. If they stopped sitting on their butts playing video ga es the whole day and rather watched how to plant a garden, sew a button or pluck a chicken they could learn everything they needed

        5. Linda S,
          Communist teachers, professors, counselors, and psychologists have had access to those crippled children for years, and have indoctrinated and coached and drilled them until it is no longer possible for them to know anything worth knowing. However, it doesn’t really matter in the long run who is to blame for ruining them. We have seen, tragically, an entire generation succumb to communist degeneration (with some happy exceptions). What will they do when somebody offers them the only things available to eat after the Schumer hits the fan, namely, raw nutria livers, June Bug grubs, and Scotch thistle?

        6. People are so dumbed down now, more will starve just for being stupid.

        7. @ Gunny1960
          Awesome thanks for the laugh regarding the bathroom quandary that a delusional 50% of the US population suffer from…. It’s XX or XY and no you cannot choose… God has already chosen for you.

        8. Even people on farms will need to bug out. Farm houses will be the honey pot for city survivors. Everyone needs a bugout location, seed supply and survival (bush food)skills to live through this one. Pree planning is essential. People on medications like thyroid or diabetes, need to talk to Dr’s for extra supply and research on ways to manufacture it yourself. Think Pigs. learn your bush foods, a lot of people survived on bush foods in the great depression. Go somewhere where nobody will find you for at least 9 to 12 months. Most of the dangerous desperate deniers will be in heaven by then. Most survivors will have survived due to a similar mind set to your own. The dangers will be less. Dont go somewhere where you cant escape a bushfire, learn backburning skills.

      3. Don’t let your normalcy bias fool you. Back then people practiced civility, moral conviction, decency, practiced Christianity and patriotism. Now you have a nation that is Hugh Hefnerized, are TV heads, brainwashed fools, not civil, used to hand outs, millions of non integrated illegals, a nation running after Satanism, immoral, teaching pedophilia is acceptable and an alternative life style in universities, and have give God the finger by kicking Him out of their families, their schools, their churches, their communities, and their hearts.
        Instead you have Satanists producing movies like The Purge and The Hunt to a brainwashed audience to train them it’s acceptable to hunt the “deplorables”. Child sex slavery is the national pass time and the repulsive and the bizare is now the normal.
        So considering all this which is the tip of the iceberg, how do you think it will all turn out?? It’s will be more like what Kevin H wrote unless this nation turns away from it’s wickedness and humbles itself before a righteous God and repents and turns from rebellious ways.

        1. Carol;
          I would not disagree with a single word.
          Yet lets never forget there are a lot and I do mean a LOT of “good” people around.
          I still refuse to believe we, the human race, is 100% doomed, have we problems, sure we do, when in the history of mankind have we not?

    2. You are absolutely right! There will be mass chaos, starvation, civil unrest, genocide, and your worst nightmare on steroids comes true!
      The people here in the US have absolutely no idea what is getting ready to happen to them! All these millennial SJW’s will absolutely lose their minds when their IPhones all go off line and they can no longer text, use Facebook, and all that other nonsense electronic media that IS their life!
      They will drop like flies, either starve to death or by some infectious disease from the unsanitary living conditions in the large cities. The cities will be death traps, the deplorable will keep right on living their lives and hopefully rebuild this country, bring back God into each and every one of our lives and once again be thankful for his love and mercy!
      Who said God does not have a sense of humor?

      1. Yes the Millenials SJWs will learn very quickly that they are entitled to absolutely NOTHING & there won’t be any “ safe spaces” for them either. All of a sudden the older generation that can actually do stuff that they are so keen to get rid of will take on a whoooooole new gleam of necessity that these Millenials never knew they had.
        But I think we will see them selling their butts on the street for food.
        Heck they’re already doing it on the Net.

        1. I agree with you 100 percent. I was born in 1952 and I know how to do with out. It was my mother and 3 brothers and 1 sister. Be safe and watch your 6.

      2. God is able to sustain the righteous who trust in their God to protect them in times of judgement. God has given us Trump as a stay to see what America will do with God. This is a time of warning and testing.

    3. Geopolitically, “he who has the gold makes the rules” & there are several nations that have been stockpiling gold like crazy over the last few years.
      When this western system crashes bad I think that these nations will take full advantage of this & just invade the nations that have been stupid enough to ignore the writing on the wall while they’re in such a weakened state.

    4. there is no pre trib rapture. that is the great deception of the “church”, especially in America, who will suffer the most, especially in their faith because they believed the lie of satan. That false doctrine did not come out until the 1800’s. The church really needs to study scripture the way God wrote it, not the way man added to it. In my opinion the greatest depression will hit the American church the hardest and many will fall away when they realize they were as the 5 unwise virgins. they are going to miss the boat so to speak when the floods come. There are so few Noahs who actually prepared for tribulation in his day.

      1. How very refreshing to see the real Christ written, Bless you Sherri!

      2. No pre-trib rapture? U better read Rev 4:1. ‘A voice sounding like a trumpet, Come up hither, and I will show you things to come.’

      3. Sherri,
        There is faith,
        Then there is religion.
        Faith is individual
        Religion is just another club used by men to beat into submission those who follow those men.
        Throughout history religion has been used to control others, and thats about it

      4. Kulafarmer Well Said Sir.
        There is faith,
        Then there is religion.
        Faith is individual
        Religion is just another club used by men to beat into submission those who follow those men.
        Throughout history religion has been used to control others, and thats about it

        Faith is the individual relationship with your Creator. Alone you will stand before God to answer the most important question. No Church “Leader” will be there as your “Defense” Attorney.

      5. Sherri, your comment is ‘right on’. The comment from Bluridge is so wrong. In Rev 4:1 John is being spoken to not the ‘church’.

      6. I’m with you Sherri, There will definately be no pre-trib. Jesus wants (us) to learn to trust Him in good times, so we can also trust Him in bad times. I see his wonderful provision all the time. What a blessing to receive what ever I need. HE Provides.

      7. Sherri is correct the word rapture isn’t in the Bible. This is a made up term of non-Catholics, mostly here in the U.S.. Jesus passed on his one church to Peter here on Earth, that is clear in the Gospels (Matthew 16:18). The Roman Catholic Church is that one church (body) that has been passed down unbroken since Peter. So, you can choose your term faith or religion, it doesn’t matter, Jesus clearly states what he expects from each one of us. In the end we will all be judged by the Lord, so word games aside!!! So, If I offended you that’s an issue you will have to work through because I’m not judging you, but you and I will be Judge for our actions or in-actions in the end by the Lord.

      8. Everyone: get out of the gov. controlled 501c3 churches now and home church or meet with small groups for Bible study. There will be gov. agents in mainline denominations (like Hitler and Stalin had) many will be arrested for taking a stand or saying the wrong thing.

      9. I believe in the Pre-Tribulation Rapture. There are many references to the return of Jesus Christ to take his Church (those people who believe in him and have asked for forgiveness of their sins). While the word Rapture is not written in the Bible, the word Harpazo is, and means Rapture. But whether one believes in the Rapture/Harpazo or not…what matters is that we admit we are sinners, ask for forgiveness of our sins, and believe in Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. In kindness and love, I disagree with Sherri about the Rapture being added to the Bible by man…unless she is referring to the man Paul, who’s description in his writtings of …the dead in Christ will rise first, and then those believers who remain will be taken up to meet Jesus in the clouds…describes the Rapture of his Church.
        As far as the next Depression hitting America, when and if it happens…who really knows. Kinda funny how It’s much easier to stock up on supplies…buy guns and ammo…stash your things in the woods…keep your gas mask next to your bed and a loaded Glock in your nightstand….All that’s much easier, it seems, than to believe that this world is not our home, and our real home is in heaven with God our Father.

      10. obitomkanobi
        faith IS the substance of things HOPED 4 & the evidence of things not s@@n !
        find me a virgin
        Noah’s no life rafts yes, collective soul just listen key.

    5. then you will be in with the first to die off and NOBODY will help you me i would just point at you laugh and walk away to leave you to your fate

      1. What are you sorry about. God gives us free will. I believe the Bible is quite clear that the Rapture will happen sometime here on earth. You believe it won’t. One way or another God will sort it all out. I hope we can agree that Jesus died for our sins, and all we need to do is admit we are sinners and believe on his name.

        I was raised Catholic…learned all their was of idol worship. Finally I realized that the Catholic Church is actually the Whore of Babylon written about in the Book of the Revelation. Decked out with gold adornments…dressed in scarlet and purple vestments. We are warned to “get out of her”.

        1. I was just going to say that but you beat me to it. There’s no pulpit here, though I am not disrespecting the views presented.

      2. Anony Mee:
        Tis never a good thing feeding the trolls, even if they are trying to preach their word.

      3. Dear NRP

        You are right, of course, and I usually refrain. Just tired I guess. My BS-immunity system might be a little low as am getting over a cold. 😄

      4. aren’t we already in the tribulation. didn’t it start with the mayan calender end date. which we realy don’t know the true date, because it no longer take the same amount of time for one rotation of the earth. gov is fully aware of this going back to the 90’s. if you listen, you can hear. if you look, you can see.

      5. Read the Revelation scriptures and tell us which one says there will not be a calling out of the church

    6. In this very real situation, blaming politicians wont save you. Severe world depression has happened before and looks likely to happen again. Your attitude will see you perish fast but you’ll do it noisily.


      1. Yup it has. Been planned for decades. Trump is working to soften the blow but it’ll still be rough for everyone.

      1. Well, if some people don’t like my opinion about the Catholic Church….let’s see how much the Catholic Church and the Vatican really do to help the people when a Depression hits this country. Will they sell off their riches, properties and investments to make an actual difference in starving people’s lives. I hope they do…but I’m not counting on that.
        As far as me preaching…it’s really only preaching to those who disagree. And if one lone voice gets you all worked up….You won’t Survive a week when the real SHTF starts.

        1. Clutch Cargo,

          I happen to agree with you on this. The pope is nothing but a socialist and an evil enabler of despicable crimes upon the young and innocent as well as other unspeakable things. I’ll have nothing to do with him or his minions.

  2. Great article Ken. Very thought provoking.

    Im sitting here in my kitchen drinking my morning medicinal tea, reflecting on this.

    I agree that it may be a sudden and deep drop. I feel that the government has been fudging the numbers, employment is simply not at the rosy levels they say it is, many, including myself are not counted as unemployed,
    Reality, i am unemployed and so are tens of millions of others.
    I feel it will get worse, much much worse, and that isnt just the pessimist speaking.

    Where i live is a bit different animal, but we are extremely exposed here as the local and state governments have gone all in on development and tourism.
    Both of these things are entirely reliant on outside inputs very much out of our control. No amount of promotion or advertising will bring tourist or new residents if the world economy is in flames, we saw this in the 90s after the Japanese economy crashed, ours closely followed and it was bad, the electrical contractor i had been working for went bankrupt and folded, they were the third largest union shop in the state.

    Nothing was fixed after the 2006-2007 decline, the economic numbers are the same if not worse, it just depends on who you are reading from.

    Zero interest rates or negative interest rates will be the norm, small banks will be swallowed by big banks propped up numerically on paper by government intervention. Not that it will matter.
    Peoples savings and retirements may well evaporate, it has happened before.

    The differences in what the outcome is will be very different geographically.
    Here on our island i doubt it will be anything at all like it is in any number of big US cities and surrounding suburbs. It may get real ugly, just look at how close to un governable and un controllable most cities are on any given day.

    Stay away from crowds!

    I feel for most areas that are heavily populated it will be awful.

    Rural, not as bad, people still have that get er done gene in them.
    My area, will be better equipped to weather this, simply because of isolation and the fact that there is still a strong sense of family. There are still many many families and extended families who have been here for generations. Many for many many generations like my family.
    There is also a strong undercurrent of the old school thought process here, in spite of the tens of thousands of transplants, many of which were drawn here by that desirable trait.

    It will be interesting.

    I could go from doing nothing today to planting all manner of crops tomorrow and be selling produce at the maturity of my earliest crops, 60 days or so. I have chosen not to. I am one insignificant invisible person. What i do means nothing.
    I personally am not concerned with a crash, we will get by, we will network and will most likely draw closer as a community as a result of one. But that is just my isolated corner of paradise.

    Elsewhere? Who knows. But i doubt it will be fun.

    1. Your isolation may be your saving grace. Also, you climate will be a huge asset, winters here in New England are going to rough…

      1. Kevin, very true for all the Northern State over all. Those who won’t be able to adapt will migrate south for warmer weather. Those who are left will be able to adapt and make it with hard work and sweat. I Have prepared & practice my gardening skills and have begun to can my garden supplies for just this reason. When asked why such a big Garden, I reply just a practice run. They laugh, the reset button is almost here and it will be very ugly. Be ready..

        1. Growing food in a SHTF world is a losing proposition. For a couple grand, you can store 10 man-years of rice, wheat, rye and pinto beans in 55 gallon barrels in your basement. 1 pound of dry ice before you seal each barrel, and they will keep for 25 years. Just remember to look hungry for the neighbors . . .

      2. predicts a drop in US population of around 200 million by 2025.


      3. Winters in the artic are especially cold and long. That’s where we find ourselves now. Need lots of firewood and fuel oil just to make it through the winter!

    2. Ken,,,,spot on!!!
      The Bible says it will be the worst time the world has EVER known. Making the great depression pale by comparison.
      I can not emphasize enough to prepare.

      Just came inside for lunch. Hung a double paned glass door on the greenhouse, moved treated plywood back on site to hang on bottom 3′ with insulation. Then I will hang windows. At 72 I work slower than at 25. Heat will be a wood burner inside greenhouse ( because I have 50 acres of wood.) Remember i built a fort ( fortified 8′ walls encompassing : the new greenhouse, garden area, fruit trees, chicken house, outhouse, 24×24 rabbit house/ haystorage, goat house with 1/4 of that building set up for two cows ( should herd need to be cut back again -Jerseys, for meat, milk, butter and cheese) so goat house not only has goat milk stand, but two stanchions for cows, plus 500 gallon tank for rain water inside goat building- garden and new greenhouse are down hill to gravity feed them also. This is all inside the fort walls.

      Now why did I do all of this???

      Because we are about to face the hardest time “EVER.”

      Thank you Ken for running this article ” warning” for everyone. It is real and it is coming to soon.

      None of us will be completely prepared, try as we might. Pray for God to lead us all.

      Peanut Gallery,,,, I have you under prayer cover several times a day; morning and nite I walk out to the fish pond and pray for your loss, our nation and it’s leaders. I lost my husband in 1975 and I have lived on, but not gotten over the hole in my heart.

      Joe C.,,,, glad Sadie is going strong. You may need her and her offspring more than you ever realize plus your horse skills and archery. Yes, at 72, I have a Horton crossbow.

      I have had horses 48 years- love ’em! Horses will go in the end of greenhouse inside fort when this collapses.

      Thank you Ken.

      1. Sage,
        That is awesome and I love your heart and passion! I hope you have a community of trusted friends nearby who can help you stand strong when needed!
        Sounds like you’re living what I would love to achieve someday with my family!

    3. Kulafarmer, I just looked up your Hawaii food stats. Seems your state IMPORTS 90% of it’s food from the Mainland.

      While you are a food producer seems aside from Sugar and maybe fishing your area requires daily imports to support the population.

      If I were you I’d expect that a lot of Hungry Not Stupid People will get together, Remember your farm and plan to Survive there. Do you think they will be polite or maybe helpful producing it?

      Maybe that hiding spot you mentioned taking your truck to is a good plan? Hopefully you have a large cache (Plan B Olive Barrel maybe?) there to support you and your Sweetheart while waiting out the great die off in Hawaii? Then maybe you can return to salvage what’s still at your old farm? At least compared to New Hampshire you have decent survivable weather year round.

      1. me2,
        I wouldn’t pick on Kulafarmer for this. The reason being, even here in the lower 48, nearly EVERYONE relies on food distribution networks. Just like the Hawaiian Islands. Granted, a good portion of the food within the lower 48 distribution system comes from the farming regions within the lower 48. However I suspect 99% of the people living in the lower 48 RELY ON IMPORTS to their region for survival. Just like Kula’s region does. Just pointing that out. Though I ‘get’ your point regarding that it’s an island. Fortunately for Kulafarmer (and the region) the climate is quite adaptable to growing their own food.

        1. Ken my comment was not intended to be “Picking” on him. I enjoy his thoughts. I was pointing out the fact Hawaii is almost like a City if you think about required food imports almost daily.

          I was giving him the advice I would give my friends if they lived there.

          If he takes advantage of his excellent climate and his knowledge of good hiding places he and his sweetheart has a far better chance to thrive than you and I. If I were to expand on my advice I would suggest he put fishing gear, including fish traps in his cache and do some guerrilla gardening of yams and such for future needs.

          Kulafarmer’s advantage is his climate. Our NH harsh weather AND poor growing season is quite the challenge. Others on this list have their own challenges to provide food to replace our storage foods.

          Your right that almost all of us depend on Just In Time Food delivery. Some of us have made extensive preps in food production and IF we can avoid them being
          “Redistributed” (Stolen) those may do well if we can survive the violence of the Chaos.

          Proverbs 13:23 Says the poor may have abundant food from their fields but injustice can sweep it away.

        2. Me2
          Let me give some clarity on the food stats.
          Our state produces less than 11% of food consumed here.
          Sounds bad ya…
          On the surface anyway.
          The island of Oahu, home of Honolulu, has 82% of the population of the entire state and accounts for less than .05% of all agricultural production.
          Now the other significant number is the number of tourist here on our island on any given day, tourist make up about 10% of the people on Maui at any average day or close to 9,000 on an island with a full time population of right about 100,000.
          Assuming the tourist stay home and the part time residents leave or dont show up because of how “bad” it is we will have about 90-100,000 people here. We produce approximately 1/3 of the total agricultural output for the state on our island, not sugar as theres no plantation any more and not pine as pine is only a small fraction of production.
          I think we will be fine,
          Belts will tighten, networks will grow and our island community may well unite like no other time since WWII
          We have tens of thousands of deer on this island, thousands of head of cattle, and tons of small producers who will join together to feed our island, with tourism all but dead, and construction at a standstill things will be much much different but will be manageable.

          Our climate, and small size will make a solution possible, we are not manhattan. And while Oahu has near 1,000,000 residents about 1/4 are military, and a large portion in service industry to the military and their families. The US Gov isnt going to starve their troops, neither will the many farmers and potential farmers going to do that,
          We have huge potential here to produce, water, climate, rich volcanic soil, but lack ability to market to the current purchasing structure at a reasonable fee because the local wholesalers are buying produce cheap from SoCal that comes out of mexico snd points south,,
          Why should anyone grow at a loss? But if there is world wide chaos, there will be no ships showing up with container loads of mexican produce so the local growers can adapt and feed the market, with competition gone, and crisis upon our community the reasons to produce become self evident, many people will trade labor to have a place to get reliable food snd even perhaps shelter. Things will necessarily be different.

          You mention bad actors,
          Knowing what i know and who i know, i also know that crap will be snuffed out and never flourish or fly. That is the beauty of a small community in crisis, things can get done and problems taken care of, this is not LA or Portland, i see people i have known for decades every time i leave my house, families that have deep roots and no qualms about protecting themselves, anyone who tries to do anything to any of them gets smoked and mysteriously is never seen again. I suspect this will become even more prevalent as time goes by.

          I have no illusion that things will be peachy, they wont, but i do have a knowledge of my AO and its makeup, the percentage of trouble makers of all colors is minute, the percentage of full time old school lifelong multi generational families is quite high, the number of uber wealthy who call this island home is large, these people are overall great folks to have around here. And most of them have chosen this place because it is NOT the west coast or east coast or even gulf coast and is so inherently different and unique that it has value far far beyond prime real estate.

          Personally, when things go sideways i plan on becoming a producer again, not for the state but for our geographic area on this island, it will be advantageous and i believe lucrative.
          Thats the beauty of a game, if you play your cards right and on the right team you will be allowed many benefits that others will have no access to.
          If you are seen as a strong asset you will be taken care of rather than abused, you just need to know when and where and how to play the game

        3. Another thing,,,
          Running, and hiding, is not in my DNA
          If there are foreign troops landing on our shores, thats a different story and 30 minutes or less and im gone,,,
          But an economic downturn? Thats not something to run from.
          And no, our whole state is not like a big city, it is far far different

        4. Kulafarmer thanks for the clarification of your Island Chain. Aside from the approximately 300,000 active duty military and their families living there who are likely to be desiring food is there no way while fuel is available that folks will not GO to the low population food producing areas of Hawaii?

          Just a though as I would be concerned if I was a short hop from Boston….

        5. M2
          If the people are from one of the outer islands and have family there, yes, conceivably they would go to a better location, but city dwellers and high density dwellers suffer from that high density mindset.
          Im not concerned, not like they will be swimming, and with no real knowledge of an area they will disappear

    4. how the heck did RELIGION get into this discussion? one thing not talked much about is how when “the bell rings”, the EBT cards quit working, and within MINUTES the people that were on them come unglued. within days the economies of scale fall apart. walmart can sell milk right now for 3 bucks, but when only 20% of the people have “money” for that, then the price will rise to the MOON. economies of scale work great to make prices go down when there’s a lot of need. when that need disappears, it causes prices to skyrocket. kula says he doesn’t THINK the employment numbers show what’s really happening, but all you got to do is go to the gubmint’s OWN WEBSITE to see that the “labor participation rate” is around 62%……that means that 38% of americans of working-age DON’T have a job. the FED’s got themselves painted into a corner, and the patches they put on the banking system in 08 are about to be torn asunder. i salute the author, and kula, for being spot-on with their words of wisdom. BTW, the FED took away the ability to rent banks our money back 10 years or so ago. how did they think that was supposed to work out?

      1. @buttcrackofdoom,
        First of all, I nearly spilled my coffee this morning while getting a good laugh at your alias name. That is certainly original!

        Also, I agree with what you’ve said. Especially this: “the FED’s got themselves painted into a corner, and the patches they put on the banking system in 08 are about to be torn asunder”

        That is exactly my opinion as well.

      2. BCofDoom ! Glad to see you are with us still. Missed seeing your comments on the “other” site and often wondered if you were still out there :)

        1. thanks for the kind words, grandee…..good to hear from you also! as far as my name, a good friend i go to the dunes with always talks of getting up at the “buttcrack of dawn”, and when i was looking for a screenname many years ago, crackofdoom was taken, so…….

        2. my shtfplan aint werkin so good. probly has sumthin to do with cookies, but not sure. right now, my latest story available there is aug 15th.

        3. BCOD
          Same here, i have to refresh right after it loads then the most recent shows,
          The site has gone to the birds anyway,

        4. it’s appalling how few comments are there nowadays…..i still read it, but i don’t know why.

    5. I calculated out the unemployment numbers a few years ago, using information that is no longer publicly available, and came up with about 29%. I counted people who count themselves as working part time when they would prefer to work full time as 1/2 a job, same for the underemployed, and I actually (shocker!) counted people who have given up on finding employment.

      I’m guessing now it’s closer to 40%, but much of the information is no longer displayed on the .gov website.

  3. Do without? phone, fast food, TV, drugs, booze, medical care, ….

    I see mass suicides. Survivor’s will be in shit hole countries where they are not slaves to the luxuries we in America have become accustomed to.

    1. Things are getting insane here in the US. The political climate is self destructing right before our eyes. Everything is going to change drastically and I believe that a bag of flour will be $35 or more in the near future. Best thing we can do is stock up and get ready to hunker down because the SHTF senerio is already in progress.
      Make sure you have plenty of every kind of ammo because it will be worth more than gold for trading. Know your neighbors, good or bad, it’s best to know what threats are around your immediate area.
      Keep your eyes on God!!!

      1. Hm. I would never ‘trade’ any ammo. It could be used against you. Just my opinion…

      2. Ozark Prepper,
        I agree. And I emphasize what you said about buying what you need, now, before prices go way up later. Or maybe not even available later.

        1. yup, in a depression, the prices of the things you NEED go up, while the prices of the things you WANT goes down…….but you will be able to afford NEITHER.

    2. Hermit Us, yes, I believe you are correct about the suicides. So many people cannot deal with life now, they won’t want to face the uncertainty. I know of several people not on prescribed mind altering drugs saying they would not want to live in a world of economic crisis.

  4. Hell on earth
    Depending on what time of the year it is will also play a part. If it’s winter there will be a mass migration of people trying to go south and leave disaster in their wake like when millions of ants or birds swarm
    Most people today suck and don’t give a damn about anyone or anything but themselves

    1. Read “Dark Winter” by John Casey. It’s the black swan event your mother warned you about. And very very few people are talking about it. GSM…

  5. I read that one out of six people work for the federal government. How long will it be before the government lays them off?

    Schools will cut back on the number of days they are open. School buses? I don’t know.

    How sad! ((Sarc) universities will close their tennis courts, workout rooms, Gymnasiums, basketball courts, soccer fields, baseball diamonds, football fields, drama clubs, choirs and all the other “country club” stuff they have.

    Dare the government increase property tax? Will they stop allowing refugees in? Will they increase taxes on corporations who produce goods thereby resulting in the corporations cutting back on staff?

    So much of the depression will be under the control of the feds. Remember, the depression of the thirties lasted much longer than anywhere else.

    Lots to think about.

    1. If the government collapses, that means not only the government workers are without money but those that depend on government money will be without. That includes those receiving Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, SSI, and other handout programs.

      1. Social Security and Medicare are not handout programs. We seniors paid into those for 40 or more years.

        1. DaisyK;
          True, SS and Medicare are not handouts, but supposedly monies that we’ve paid which have been set aside for us. However, those monies will go POOF and disappear should the government collapse. Kind of like whatever we have in the bank.

        2. The government decides what money is ‘available’ to whomever. Yes, you and I have paid into SS for decades and we deserve to receive our SS pensions. But the government can decide that it cannot afford to give you the money you were counting on from SS. You have no recourse. If we are only counting on our SS pensions, we are screwed.

        3. This is why we plan for zero income from our pension and SS. A true financial collapse will mean the end of the monetary income stream. Cash-on-hand will have different values, as will precious metals. Barter will become normalized. Those ‘without’ (the enormous mass of Americans) will be forced to a very different lifestyle and mode of operation.

          It would take nothing but a Federal Order to halt these government ‘benefits’ if America suffers a true financial collapse. At that point, say goodbye to the 50+ programs that prop people up. Say goodbye to Social Security, government/non-government pensions, and a big fare-the-well to Medicare (and Medicaid).

          Bottom line, if America suffers a financial collapse, the health & welfare segment of the Federal government will be all but shut completely down, I believe. Monies, if there is anything there, will be channeled into the Continuity of Government plans, and the Dept of Defense.

        4. Not handouts. Ponzi schemes. Someone else already has your money. You only get paid, if the government can fool someone else, they way they fooled you. But all Ponzi schemes come to an end, and those will too. You can bitch when it does . . . but you likely voted for the con-artists who put them in place.

      2. ToCor
        I paid into SS for decades, thats my money.
        I paid into Medi for decades as well,,, that is also my money,,
        So remind me again why people like you think its a handout???? Hmmm

        1. Sounds to me like it’s more of a trap. The government has you depending on them for your own money.
          It’s more than likely not there anyway. You are receiving what they borrow from your grandchildren.

        2. Who said anything about depending on them cuz???
          Only thing i can depend on the gubermint for is to be corrupt

        3. @Kulafarmer,

          Well I’m glad for you if you aren’t. Your statement above led me to believe that perhaps you were. My bad, my apologies.
          Couldn’t agree more about most of the government.

        4. CuzM
          No apology necessary,
          I actually dont plan on ever seeing one dime from them

        5. Sure. All the people who pay into Ponzi schemes think their money is sitting somewhere, waiting for them. It ain’t. It’s gone. No lock box. You only get paid, if they can keep robbing new people, the way they robbed YOU. Don’t count on it.

      3. Social Security is not a hand out program. All of us except “government workers” have been forced to pay into the SS/medicare system. They are not welfare programs. I am going to love watching the bureaucrats lose their retirements..

        1. Brian

          There was a period of several years in the 1980s when federal workers did not pay into SS (but did into Medicare and federal pension). That was not their choice. This was reversed and now they pay like everyone else. However, it had the impact of drastically reducing benefits. To qualify for full SS benefits, feds who got the “windfall” of not paying during this period have to pay a “substantial contribution” into the program for a minimum of 30 years.

          This happened to me. So, while I was a new fed in a low-paying entry level job, and didn’t have to pay in a few hundred dollars, I had to work extra years later and pay in thousands. Some windfall!!!

        2. Social Security is nothing more than an extra income tax. You have no property right in it, and the government can change the rules or eliminate it at any time. Supreme Court ruled in the 1960’s that you have no right to anything, and that SS contributions were just an income tax. In other words, it is an entitlement program. Truth hurts.

      4. Social security and medi care programs, I’ve payed every day that I have worked into those programs. Not entitlements. Study history, wasn’t it Plato who said, those who forget history….are doomed to repeat it? Employ your critical thinking skills.

        1. Study History: See Ponzi Schemes. You paid in. Your money is gone. Thems the facts.

  6. An old country preacher that I knew and loved for years, was a smart man. People would ask him “Preacher, what’s your eschatological (study of the end-times) opinion, a pre-millennial, mid-millennial, or post millennial rapture (Christ’s gathering of the faithful to Him)? He always answered the same “Christ is coming back…..don’t know when……….better be ready”.

    He covered a lot of ground in those few words, and they would apply to talk of a coming depression/catastrophic hard times. It’s inevitable it’s going to happen, it’s anybody’s guess when it will happen, and……….you had better be ready when it gets here.

    That old preacher knew that when Christ returns there are going to bad times like mankind has never seen. The question posed to him was in hopes that he would assuage fears by saying that Christ would call His faithful to Him before the suffering began. He couldn’t do that. Neither can I. There just isn’t enough scripture for me to say, one way or another.

    That’s one of the many reasons I see to prepare. I know bad times are coming. They are inevitable, whether coinciding with Christ’s return or purely man caused.

    Like the old preacher said, “It’s a’coming, don’t know when, better be ready”. He was talking about being ready in your relationship with God through His Son Jesus………and I suspect, the hard times that will precede that event.

    Sorry about the proselytizing, but I feel stronger about that preparation than all the others combined.

    1. Amen Dennis, trusted friends and a relationship with your creator is the greatest value in this coming time of troubles.

    2. Dennis, this argument will never be settled. BUT, I read Luke 21 often and I feel it is preaching that even the righteous will suffer.
      I always giggled at the church members that hee-hawed about my prepping food and supplies.
      Their attitude was that God will provide and we will be taken and be cared for.
      And then I just ask why they have health insurance, auto insurance, homeowners, & savings accounts???
      No replies yet.

  7. I’m not at all sure, what actually keeps the “money system” afloat. We all know we can never EVER repay our nation’s existing debt. What is 22-23 trillion dollars? I’m not really sure. I do know, it can never be repaid. It’s all a pyramid (ponzi) scheme. Money is only money because others will accept it as valuable. IF/WHEN that ever stops, then we’ll see.

    I’ve always considered a grid-down scenario as my worst nightmare. A financial crash will be as bad or may even include a grid-down. Why would electrical workers even show up for worthless pieces of paper? They won’t. I won’t blame them, though I’ll likely be angry. Not even I can stay angry for very long, too much effort.

    All we can hope to do, is prepare. Will it be enough? Only time will tell. I can only hope to be surrounded by friends and family. Where we go from there, is unknown and cannot be known. It would be a challenge that none of us has ever faced. Am I ready? Hell no, I’m not ready. I’ll never be ready. I enjoy electricity, running water, and all the things that come with it.

    I’ll not be a suicide. I’ll try my best to make the best life for my family, I can provide. It will not be anything like the life I’ve lived to this point. Will I succeed or fail? Who knows. Besides, who decides what is success and what is failure. I suppose a smile and a hug from a well fed grand child would go a long ways.

    1. FYI – The tipping point on the National Debt is approx. $26 Billion. At that point, all current revenue levels, at the 2017 interest rates, would not be able to meet the interest payments on the debt. Even DJTrump mentioned this number during his campaign and it has been verified by a few others.

      Today, more tax money is coming into the Treasury since more people are working. More countries are paying tariffs which go straight into the Treasury. The Treasury is raking it in, so is Society Security contributions, which go directly into the general fund now.

      If you noticed, POTUS Trump stated, just yesterday, that he would like the interest rates to come down (to stay even with the rest of the world’s negative interest rates so we can stay financially competitive internationally) and the Treasury can then refinance out debt…in effect, this buys us some time to get the national budget under control. To bring the budget under control will require a herculean effort. If the Lefties gain control of the White House and Congress in 2020, kiss your hinder-quarters goodbye…you may have 18 to 24 months before things go belly up federally and in most states, due to universal health care which you will pay through the nose for, plus all the freebies the Lefties want to give those who do not contribute to society. It will be the largest transfer of wealth in this nation at any time. In addition, it has been estimated that your federal taxes will increase by 100%, so if you pay 20% in federal taxes now, you’ll be paying 40% plus SS contributions which the Lefties want to raise to about 10%-15% to help fund medical care for all…basically non taxpayers. You will see a corresponding rise in state and local taxes as well and the few remaining tax free states will no longer exist.
      In short, the Middle Class is going to be intentionally evaporated, and then you’ll have a great Marxist society of a rich ruling political class and their rich elitist bankers and others, and poor slaves.

      1. I think that tipping point is unknowable, and a Black Swan. Things go on and on and on, long after we’re all sure they can’t go on any longer. Then, suddenly, boom. The Archduke of Austria is shot, and 20 million people die. How did the USSR go on for 70 years? How does Cuba go on? How does Japan go on, with an aging population and exploding debt? Who knows? It does, until it doesn’t.

  8. Doomer porn. I hope you all were not eating Cheetos when you read this.

    1. Ahhhhh, here we go… I was wondering how long it would take before the first smack-down ;)

      Maybe tomorrow I’ll do an article on cute little kittens and puppies playing together. Actually, now that I think about it, a website like that would probably get tons of clicks! Doesn’t just about everyone love puppies and kittens? Yep, I think I’ll deep-six MSB for puppies and kittens. Thanks for the inspiration!

      1. Ken J
        If you deep 6 your MSB site we are all calling Mrs. J….

        1. Maybe the unicorn farts destroyed the environment for the dinosaurs?

    2. And the prize for being first to drink the kool-aid is…………….?

      Optimist who bought everything brother Jim had to sell!!!!!!!!!!!

      Come on up optimist. Optimist? Optimist? Anybody see optimist?

      What’s that??????? Dead?????

      Oh well. Who’s next? Don’t crowd the barrel, there’s plenty to go around…………

      1. I have heard it said that tobe a prepper is to be the ultimate optimist, you are ready for whatever or will adapt to deal with it, that sounds pretty optimistic to me,

        Now if we had this day in day out the sky is falling, i might be a pessimist, but we dont, not on Kens site anyways,,

        I personally feel that it is optimistic to face a challenge, discuss it, listen to what others views are on it and then be able to reflect on what you read or discussed and form a plan of attack,
        I see confidence, optimism, and a slew of other traits, but not doom porn,

        1. Kula,
          That just proves (seemingly) that the person is not a regular here. Rather, possibly, just a troll looking to inject dissent. This site is rationale, practical, sensible. Even when addressing topics of so called “doom”. We here understand that “doom” could indeed happen. And it’s one of the things we prepare for. Similar to insurance for a house fire. Although this topic is FAR beyond that one!

        2. Ken,
          Another great article!
          This a topic of conversation around my tribes campfire.
          Hope you and yours are well.
          Good to see new folks as well as the regulars commenting here.
          Ken,when it comes to naysayers and trolls it’s mind over matter.
          You don’t mind…
          They don’t matter…

        3. Hey Billys horse,,,
          Hows it going?
          Hope all is good, good to see you, miss your regular commentary,

        4. Hey Kula,
          Glad to see you’re still kicking!
          I notice you are posting more.
          I always enjoy your posts cuz your blunt and don’t apologize for it.
          If folks don’t like it they can always set themselves on fire in protest.
          Been working more than I care to but it’s hard to say no to people in need.
          Some people get what’s going on but way too many are self centered fools who will seal their own fate…

  9. Drugs. Now days I think the gov will make certain drugs legal should all go haywire. The legalization of marihuana points to this. The plant is illegal federally, but it is not enforced in the states. I always found this odd. Perhaps they will even give drugs out en mass to pacify. Would be fairly easy to do. Some of the masses/gimmes are already addicted. I sometimes watch the show Drug Inc. on cable. Very informative. The Mexican cartels are producing a high quality meth and selling it cheap in order to addict more users. Meth is highly addictive. Cocaine addicts are going to meth because it is cheaper and the high last longer than cocaine. Meth does not have to be grown it is cooked chemicals and horrible nasty chemicals at that! Also people don’t eat much when they are buzzed. Then again maybe the gov will hand out oxy or some other tranquillizer in the cities. ??? I am not here to argue the medicinal use of pot. Just throwing another idea into the ring.

    We are in a VERY different time than the 1930’s. I think about where my momma grew up. There was a plethora of family members all within 2 miles or so. Not so anymore in most instances.

    1. Pssst….Mrs.USMCBG
      The gov is already heavily involved in drug distributions

      1. Yeah MT, that got me laughing! VA is getting to roll out a new nasal spray to combat veterans suicides. I want to approve but…….

    2. Mrs.USMCBG
      Or the problem will be those who can no longer get their prescription drugs that get them through the day

    3. A big difference from the 30s is what will happen when the banks close. Many banks closed then and people lost all their deposits but I haven’t read about any of the banks being destroyed.. Now days people wont just peacefully walk away, I think they will torch the banks, possibly with the workers inside.

  10. One of my primary thought processes for this article was to imagine, discuss, the probable differences between the Great Depression of the 1930’s and what a similar or worse Greatest Depression would be today. That’s regardless of one’s opinion “if” we ever get another one (though I believe it’s inevitable).

    Those who truly believe it’s ridiculous or “doom” to discuss this, well, all I can suggest is to change the channel. This issue is among the top issues of concern for many/most preparedness-minded people. And even (hopefully) if this does not happen, it is a good exercise to throw out opinions how it might go down, and/or how one might deal with the catastrophe. That’s how we turn “doom” into productive constructive preparedness.

    1. Ken,
      I have had discussions about this recently with people who are definitely not considered preparedness minded.
      They are considering the very real possibility that things may get spicy over the next year or two. There are lots of factors contributing to this concern, and was quite surprising as well as satisfying to have had those discussions.

    2. Has anyone heard discussions about how to survive on Mars? It sounds like a ridiculous waste of time to spend a moment thinking about it, but it is actually very instructive. Nobody here will ever set foot on Mars, but to try to figure out how it could be done could very easily give you some ideas on how to survive on earth.

      Just try to imagine how you could make the 8 month long journey in a spaceship; food, clothing, water, air medical and physical needs. There would have to be something from that you could apply to your life now. This is how I digest this topic, the greatest depression. Imagine what it would be like, what you would do to adapt and you might find yourself using that idea tomorrow in your everyday life.

    3. I have read many of the replies to the article and there are many reasonable thoughts on what lies ahead and ways to handle the situation. What is being left out is the fact that it will be Global. China for one will be in deep trouble with its billions in population. China knows that to quell a riot and a goverment take over they will have to blame someone to appease the people. That blame will go to America and its bounty in resources. That was told to a reporter who had interviewed their leader. You want have just the zombies, dirtbags, and hungry people to deal with but China,Russia, Cuba,Mexico, Venezuela, Iran, Syria and most likely North Korea. China and Russia both have said that we will attack when the nation is in turmoil or civil war. China and Russia has a large amount of our national debt and land and resources will be the redeemer. It very well may go Nuclear but one has to think they would rather not if possible try not to pollute their new resources. The one that said ” Be Ready and Stay Ready in The Lord has it correct. For if you truly belong to Him then fear not what man can do to the body. But fear the one who can throw both soul and body into the pit. Absent from the body present with the Lord. Your going home.

  11. Loss of our economic system may not be much different than loss of the electrical system (which may be a result of the depression as well). So, much of “One Second After” could happen.

    When the food stamps stop, full riots will begin, with destruction of just about everything that can be damaged, burned, stolen, …

    In the great depression, people still had some morals and dignity – not today. Just Mad Max.

    1. While I was thinking about this, I did wonder about a resultant “Mad Max” world. In my view it could be a very real possibility, or at least a shade of it.

    2. Hermit,
      Spot on with the morals and dignity,
      I like reading through Woodpile,
      If you do as well, note how Remus pictures of migrant workers or laborers are almost entirely caucasian individuals,,,
      Our world has changed, im still one of the labor types so used to digging, growing, picking, building, making,,,,
      How many would rather riot than roll up their sleeves and get working,,,,,

  12. Personally, we have focused on two ‘disaster’ threats because they are the most dangerous, they are highly probable, and they would be the most devastating to America at this time:
    1 – financial collapse
    2 – long-term grid-down

    So we have spent the past 10 years focusing our preparedness on those disaster threats. Both of those disasters result in similar outcomes, even thought they are very different threats. A financial collapse and a long-term grid-down lifestyle would rapidly destroy our society as we know it, causing extreme fear, chaos, violence, and a forced change in everyone’s life. The masses of non-thinkers, gimme-dats, and criminals would be hurled into extreme situations and none of them would be tolerant or understanding or kind. We MUST be ready for the masses if they run interference.

    We have given considerable thought to this. We have worked hard on perimeter protections, defensive strategies, home protection, etc. It will never be good enough. They.Will.Not.Ring.The.Doorbell.

    While we would be shifting our own lifestyle into a more pared-down version of life in the 1800s, the majority of those people beyond our small rural region would be panic-stricken, angry-as-hell, ready to fight, or ramping up for looting, crime sprees, gang attacks, and worse. Will there be a “Golden Horde”? Would gangs make it here?

    What would the worst phase of the disaster-strike be? The first 30, 60, and 90 days after? Or would it be a year-long destruction — or longer, as it was with The Great Depression?

    American society as it is today is NOTHING like America in the 1930s…back then, people used their hands, they sweat, they had gardens and small homesteads. THEY WERE MORE CIVIL. Most believe in, and feared, God. Not so in today’s America. How can we predict the collective reactions of the majority of our population when we have nothing to truly compare?

    From where we sit, we believe our lifestyle would be pared down into a very simple, very hands-on lifestyle: life in the 1800s…. but that simplicity will be threatened with people who know and want violence because of the extreme changes forced upon society. Other dangers, like illness or age-related health problems will factor in to our lives, but the days of lengthy and expensive hospital stays and ‘wonder drugs’ would be over.

    All that we can do, given that we see the underlying factors of these 2 disaster threats, is prepare as best as we are able to. We have stayed out of debt and have enough cash on hand to pay real property taxes for several years, if needed. Of course, the future real property taxes owed are today’s dollars, not Zimbabwe’s. How sad that the only real ‘need’ for cash is for the tax man….

    So we have examined and analyzed how we could live without any income whatsoever — this would mean that our current lifestyle takes a big-giant-step back a century, into a world where everything is manual and horsepower is literally from horses, or man.

    We work with our hands. We can fix things. We grow food and save seeds and preserve harvests. We understand simple machines. We have “the backup plan” where we can live like we’re in the 1800s, if the world spins backwards in time. We have lived on our homestead for decades now. We make stuff, and we do it ourselves. But if either of us were to fall ill, we would not have modern medicines…

    If we live in the 1800s, our focus on what matters becomes more blatantly obvious. We work harder for the simple things. We grow and raise our own foods. We work from dawn to dusk. And then some. We grow herbs to make healing teas and salves. We use our preps: our pantry of food, our long-term food storage, our medications that were bought just-in-case. We might barter with a neighbor. We might join together to protect our area. We do as we have done before — we live.

    1. MT
      Today so many people are too good for menial jobs,,,
      Need to work to get vegetables to feed your family? Oh, you dont want to? Its beneath you? Your degreed?
      The rate of attrition will be quite high.
      I have been told i have an obligation to grow food for our community. Was told this by someone who thought i charged too much for my produce.

      1. Kula,
        So many are fired-up on self-importance, aren’t they?

        I always loved these words in a song I enjoyed:
        “Hollow people rattle when you shake them”

        Keep it up, Kula. You’re shaking it up over there!

      2. Kulafarmer
        I got a strong back, steel toes
        I’m handy with a wrench
        There’s nothin’ I can’t drive
        Nothin’ I can’t fix

        I work sun up to sundown
        Ain’t too proud to sweep the floors
        From the song Cost of Livin by Ronnie Dunn
        A dying breed

      3. People tip Waiters $20.00 or more but they won’t think of paying fair price for produce at a farmers market.

        1. “Fair price”

          The price people will pay for any product, be it goods or services, is what the people believe the product is worth — what the market will bear.

          “Fair price” is a phrase that the Left has injected so that people will start believing socialist culture.

        2. So 96790
          What will a fair price be when there is no food at foodland or Safeway and Costco has empty shelves?
          Ill bet that wednesday market at Wailani and the saturday market at longs will be monster size with people trading or paying whatever they can,
          Personally im not leaving the farm, ill let someone rlse take stuff to the markets and i will just sell or barter from our homestead,

      4. Yep–from someone that NEVER went out back and picked a tomato for supper from his raised bed.

        1. My comment is reaction to this just to be clear:
          “””Was told this by someone who thought i charged too much for my produce.”””

        2. Yep, exactly, if people dont have dirt under their finger nails they aint tryin

    2. The Fifteenth United States Census, conducted by the Census Bureau one month from April 1, 1930, determined the resident population of the United States to be 122,775,046, an increase of 13.7 percent over the 106,021,537 persons enumerated during the 1920 Census.

      The population of the United States was counted as 308,745,538,[4] a 9.7% increase from the 2000 Census. This was the first census in which all states recorded a population of over half a million, as well as the first in which all 100 largest cities recorded populations of over 200,000.

      Nearly 200,000,000 more mouths to feed and the vast majority have no means or the mental ability to feed themselves. The next great depression will end America as we know it. Roosevelt took advantage of the economic situation during the Great Depression and ushered in socialism to ease the burden. The next one will end with a complete communist takeover for “the good of the people” and to “save the country”.

      1. Romeo Charlie,
        I do suspect that something new will be ushered in to “save the country”. And it’s not going to be good…

        Conspiratorial minds might think this may be part of the plan…

        1. G.H.W.B. said ” We will succeed “, so it’s pretty much a done deal. Just a matter of time.

        2. Although, I’d rather see revival before the rider on that red horse shows up!

        3. That time being the Lord’s timing.
          Hoping that He gives us more time to get right with Him.

  13. Like Modern Throwback we have looked at the 2 scenarios of extended grid down and total financial collapse as being the most devastating to our society and have moved our planning in that direction.
    Differences between now and then have been mentioned . I think that a large problem will be the result of thousands of people not getting their prescription drugs. Whether it is a diabetic or someone with severe anxiety issues, it will not be pleasant.Another big problem will be people who are drug addicts and will not be able to get their heroin,meth, or whatever.
    Most people today do not have the seeds, knowledge or tools to know how to grow food nor how to preserve it . Our grocery store system today is on a J I T product delivery, unknown in the 1930′ s.
    The huge difference from then to now in morals, civility, and the sense of right or wrong will make things very unpleasant .
    I have not met a person who can make their own toilet paper at home , 3-4 days without it will ruin anyone’s disposition.
    Major cities will be hell-holes, get out if possible. If whatever it is happens in wintertime the population will be much smaller in the springtime.
    I agree with Dennis that the most important prep is to get right with God ,through Jesus. I do not wish to go through hell on earth without Jesus. I believe our earthly time alive is only part of our total journey.
    Blessings to all

  14. I’ll take that heat off of ya Ken. My true opinion will upset many. It’s not my goal but it’s what I believe:

    There will most likely be an invasion as it declines or reaches the unsustainable line.

    Unlike Mexico or Venezuela the wealth potential is too great though we don’t take advantage of it any longer. In fact it’s almost to where more or an equal number foreigners have tangible American assets of value than we do. The American people are not the value it’s in the land, oil, minerals etc. we (of 2 specific races) aren’t needed nor wanted as we don’t do our own labor work in most cases anymore. The other work we will be replaced by other nationalities.

    Most Americans will assimilate rather than die if given the choice. The small amount of resistance won’t last long or in meaningful effectiveness.

    We no longer posses the characteristic to join together to fight a common enemy. It ain’t like the 3%ers, BLM, rainbow coalition and some bikers are all gonna join up to hold the line in a fight.

    The military is no longer able to maintain with the current quality or lack of in its base troops. It’s more about the check than the country. A large majority of the country wouldn’t support them once the fighting started and they are NOT set up to fight here and will need logistical support including housed but they will be denied. Our “allies” are already weak and cracking under the weight of world ongoings.

    The “vets” are weak having been taught to be so they can draw the check and the benefits” and aren’t in fighting shape anymore. They talk big but you can’t even get them to place a job app in jobs requiring violence.

    The “militias” will fall quickly. They only want to fight our own government and lack logistics.

    Law enforcement is the same. Those few that resist will fall due to lack of support, supplies or others backing them up.

    Most “preppers” will try n hide and ride it out but will ultimately fail in that course of action. They will take a side and it will be the one that leads to survival rather than freedom. The few remaining “survivalist” will split with some fighting and some hiding.

    China is the most likely but it could be others or a combination. It will be whoever is able to prop up those country the longest. My best estimate is 2 weeks for 3/4 of the physical area to be under foreign control. The heartland will be last. Hawaii isn’t a full afternoon and Alaska will be ignored till later. Places like Puerto Rico will latch on to any promise given by anyone offering free.

    1. Matt in OK
      You are not far off the foreigners owning the USA. It started a long time ago, an they have been slowly buying our lands with the blessing of our overlords aaah I mean the swamp rats g o v.

    2. me2
      I believe nukes will be used. What use are the major population cities like NYC, LA, DC etc? I’ve already stated they don’t need The People just the resources.

      Why do you think we are yet again in a Cold War arms race? Hypersonic buzz words, nuke shelters flying off the assembly lines and thyroid pills being sold on amazon like vitamins for the public.

      1/2 the folks on here right now are DC fanboys on one side or the other who think some guy is their savior or the devil. Neither have mustard of their own and are reliant on politicians. It’s comical and sad. It gets nuked by the enemy and all the fanboys hit the floor. They wouldn’t even know what they are fighting for.

      Deep state isn’t the biggest threat. It’s just the closest you are bombarded with.

      1. Matt sadly you might be right. Better fast destruction to slow Venezuela 2.0 Deep State Edition.

        At least Ken put it out there for folks to ponder and hopefully act.

        I’m at peace with my creator and will do what I can to protect and provide for my family.

        Matthew chapter 24

  15. In the end .. the world will have one currency. Such a global depression would be the precursor to such an event. Simply, all debt all current cash assets would be nullified. Everyone, every country starts at zero. Then everything becomes dependent on the new currency. The main who instigates this ‘solution’ will be hailed a hero. Will take on the leadership of the new government.

    Will this happen? The bible tells us it will. Will it occur as I mentioned above. Who knows? But it is a possible outcome.

    1. Bingo! Spot On Jafo. I wouldn’t be surprise somewhere around this country in a secured warehouse locations there are vats of the new currency, maybe we’ll call the “rainbows”. We’ll have to trade in our ”greenbacks” 100 to one and give an allegiance to our new leader. Of coarse after all the killing is done in the population centers.

      1. It won’t be a physical currency. If recent trends are followed (India and others) the old currency will be replaced by electronic digits based on some actual and supposedly unforgeable calculation such as energy output.

  16. My parents and my wife’s parents lived thru the last depression.We have heard their stories,and learned from them.The wisdom of the old folks is largely responsible for our current efforts to get better prepared.

    It’s not to late to get started.The tricky part of a collapse is how long the recovery may take.You have to survive until things get a little better.

    In case there are any non preppers reading this let me say this.

    If you don’t want to watch your children die of hunger,thirst,or disease,then get your ass in gear.Dont listen to the nay sayers,your are responsible for the welfare of your family!!

    Food,water,medicine,shelter,security,and tangible items for barter are required.And a little luck.

    “Something evil this way comes”. Enough said.

    God Bless All! Long Live The Republic!

    1. And I would add to Norml Chuck’s comment: don’t go to the country expecting there to be food growing. There hasn’t been human food out here for decades.

  17. A lot of the farms (most?) that I drive by these days don’t seem to have gardens. Around the time of the first Farm Aid in the mid-1980’s, Willie Nelson was remarking about the oddity of having to give farmers money for food, and explained that they only grow monocultures of dent corn or soy.[ Actually, the explanation is my interpretation of what he actually meant.] Hopefully their gardening learning curve won’t be as long as mine.
    Imagine the surprise of the golden hordes walking for days into the countryside expecting to find food, and finding none.

    1. Their gardens are probably hidden from your view.

      Trust me, ALL farmers are self-reliant. Perhaps there is an exception out there, I have never seen one. I grew up in central MN, in the heart of midwest dairy country. Believe me, the majority of farmers will outlive 99% of city dwellers BECAUSE they are self reliant. And because they have fear and respect for the Creator. Judgement is coming to America because we corrupted the world with our Sodom and Gomorrah way of life here in the USA.

      A desire to change, and then Jesus Christ – this is the ONLY way out.

      Redeem the time.

      1. I to grew up in the Midwest. I can also say a great many farmers are no longer self reliant. They rely on chemicals and fertilizers to grow their crops. I can tell you that most farms now are exceeding large and into the monoculture existence. We are talking corporation size not the 40-150 acre farms I knew growing up. Most do not have gardens anymore. A small few do and most rely on the Amish/Mennonite populations to grow actual food that they then purchase. It is a area with small rural dying towns and almost all now rely on outside sources for food. It’s crazy. They may be able to shift production but there will be a learning curve especially if there are no fertilizers and chemicals to spray on crops to prevent weed and bug damage. I’m a realist and unfortunately many in the farmlands may not fair any better than those in towns. Dairy farmers in my midwest are going to large confinement facilities. We call them Dutch farms. They feed the cows huge bales of hay that you need tractors to move. The cows are kept in barns always. Enough room to stand turn around and laydown, that’s it. The hay is even brought in on trucks and isn’t grown by the farmer. Growing up the cows were on pastures and fed from what the farmer grew during the winter. Farmers today are a long ways from the self reliant farmers of old and I’m only 50 so it really wasn’t all that long ago. The whole country is going to be in a world of hurt.

        1. MM
          Excellent comment on most farming methods today. We are screwed.

          Your description called “monoculture” is a disease brought on by greed and laziness. I witnessed this trend probably 50 years ago, when one crop of grain was seeded on all a farmer’s cultivated land, harvested, and then it was off to the sunny south in the motor home for the winter. No crop rotation, just pour on the fertilizer and to hell with the land for future generations.

          The same applies to most of American production: monomanufacturing just one widget per plant. Simplify, no extensive staff training, no diversified stock on hand, …

    2. many of my farmer friends here in middle TN have to be careful how and where they place their home gardens.

      overspray or a windy day and the roundup kills all their home garden produce.

      seen it many times. the farmer apologizing to his wife that he sprayed the fields and it got into and killed her garden. some plant a “buffer row” or two to take the field spray and save having to re-plant the home garden.

  18. “Now hiring” signs and help wanted ads will disappear. Less vehicle traffic as the kidz stop cruising around- no more extra money, less eating out… more shoplifting and people “tresspassed” from stores.
    More property crimes, more wailing and gnashing of teeth, more people walking, tech and unnecessary purchases will collapse.
    Bicycles will be more valuable, there will be more thrift stores and flea markets, more homeless as they can’t pay the rent, others will move in with their parents, sleeping in cars/disease/dirty laundry (just think “San Francisco..) more “roommates” and carpooling, loan defaults…
    Valuable jobs might include security guards & grocery store employees.
    People will become more attractive as they lose weight…(okay, I threw that one in there for grins…)
    Neighborhood watches will actually become just that…

    As for the best places to live, look at a physical map of North America- the brown areas = not so much.
    Oh- and those puppies and kitty cats Ken mentioned? Well, lets just say people will use wood for cooking more as they can’t pay their gas & electric bills…

  19. Well, many of us have posted on many websites about the coming festivities. A year or two ago, I posted on this site about a You Tube video titled: FIVE REASONS WHY AMERICAN RIOTS WILL BE THE WORST IN THE WORLD. Keep in mind, TPTB know the sand is just about out of the hour glass. This is why all of these proposals are floating around about more QE, payroll tax adjustment, etc. TPTB are desperately trying to keep kicking the can down the road.
    It remains to be seen what will actually happen. With the amount of “GIMME-MY-FREEBIES” drones and parasites, I do not see the FEDGOV collapsing and an “ESCAPE FROM NEW YORK” scenario starting. TPTB would have nowhere in the world where they could hide. There will be a reset. Debt forgiveness, dual currencies, or in the gravest extreme, WWIII. The Sheeple will continue to drink the Kool-Aid and life will go on.

  20. There’s a disaster waiting to happen, for which the Feds have been prepared to respond to for three years now, and it is now coming to life. However, the best laid plans often go sideways in unimaginable ways.

    There is an expected devastating earthquake — the Big One — that will hit and affect no only California, but the entire Left, from British Columbia, to the west side of the mountains in Washington state, Oregon, and Cali and into the Baja peninsula. The two major quakes recently experienced in Cali are a precursor to the Big One. There have been thousands of aftershocks reported since then. What wasn’t expected is the enlargement of the magma pool that covers 17 states in whole or in part. Yellowstone is not the problem per some Volcanologists.

    There are eight volcanoes that are showing signs of activity, and this activity is increasing. These are centered in northern Cali and in Oregon. The DHS expects 30′ tidal surges (that is three stories of rushing water) inundating the coast lines of Washington and Oregon. These levels will diminish as you go south…down to approximately a 10′ surge.

    The expected death toll from three years ago was expected to be in the tens of thousands and those requiring emergency medical care would be well over a million, and countless number trapped in the debris.

    All utilities up and down the Left Coast will no longer exist … it is expected that all water mains, electrical lines, gas lines, and sewer lines will erupt. It is expected that all roads and bridges will be damaged so bad, they cannot be used. The affected population are expected to “walk out” of the disaster zones to relief camps. It would take the US Military about 7 to 14 days to set up camps outside of the affected zone. Materials were prepositioned on existing military bases and in government lands outside the zones.

    It is expected that there will be uncontrollable riots in the major cities. It will indeed look like the end of the world for many people.

    How will this affect the rest of the country? DHS has a contract with Wal-Mart that stipulates in the case of a national or regional emergency, ALL/EVERYTHING in their sores and warehouses will be under the control of DHS and the Military. How many shop at Wal-Mart for their food, prescriptions and sundries? What does this do the remaining food storage and food stores Under Executive Order #13603 (you can find and read it on the Web — and it has not been rescinded by the current administration) all food and medicines and everything else, can be controlled by the Feds.

    One thing that hasn’t been examined, but the banks were briefed and prepared for it 7 years ago, is a bank holiday! You will not have access to cash or credit cards or your accounts. You will not be able to pay your bills unless special exemptions are made. [This came to me thru a CEO of a very large regional bank.] Ergo — You better have a stash of emergency cash to top off food, medical, and sundry preps, be able to afford gas for your vehicle, plus be able to keep extra fuels at home. The Feds will control not only the distribution of food, toiletries (including toilet paper and paper products!), medicines and fuels, they will be able to control everything, not only in the affected zones and areas, but nation-wide.

    If or when this tragedy occurs, you will have to act very, very quickly to stock up your preps with canned goods, top off your freezers with perishable meats, and have the extra transportation fuel you will need, as well as heating oil. There is the possibility of Brown Outs in the adjacent states in order to met the power needs in the affected areas.

    Financially, the USA is the only game left in the world. Everyone is bringing their money to invest and make money. If our country goes down, the entire world goes with us. Remember what John wrote in Revelations about Babylon has fallen…

    Much of the information I’ve reiterated above originally came from Steve Quayle’s site over the past years, some of the most interesting I copied, just in case. Other information came to me from people I know in the financial fields, whom, of course, know the movers and shakers and higher ups.

    Stay Prepared

    Hey Kulafarmer….good to see your still alive and kicking.

  21. Finally, the good news are the Americans would stop invading all the countries in the name of democracy, when in reality they only do it to serve the big corporations that would rob the natural resources of the poor people. They would be too much busy to kill all their sophisticated neighbors (Love thy neighbors, how to make friends Dale Carnegie book is a forgotten way of life) and a lot of people would breathe some relief. What Americans fear about the N.W.O. is seen by ordinary folks as another New American World Order or Empire that would be enforced for all the ordinary people for the countries of the planet. Only rogue Americans (with their teenager mindset) think they are entitled for peace and prosperity forever!

  22. I think a viable resistance will form.It is already in place in some areas.Angry folks are not easily defeated.
    They may get you,but make sure that they burn their feet on hot brass.

  23. When I think about the Great Depression, I think about the novel “Grapes of Wrath”. I don’t think the coming economic collapse will be anything like that. It won’t be a depression – something that we can recover from. It will be a collapse – something that must be completely rebuilt. And it will have to be built differently since this design didn’t seem to work.

    I believe that we are currently in the slow stage of collapse, and are quickly approaching the tipping point that results in global economic catastrophe. The current means of economic measures are biased towards what benefits the top 1%, not how the bottom 75% live our daily lives. Current stories about the good economy are propaganda meant to delay revolt/placate the masses as long as possible.

    I live in a small, rural community. All of my preps (and those of my friends) have been based on the premise that we need to be a resource for our community to survive, whether it be isolation from natural disaster, economic collapse, EMP, or plague. My focus (as a professional food service guy) is on food production and preservation. Others are focusing on security, medical, transportation and communication, etc.

    My friends and I are nowhere near ready for societal collapse, but every step forward is a better chance for surviving the shit storm that is undoubtedly on it’s way, given to my generation by those who made decisions based on unsustainable, globalist, corporate-capitalist greed.

    Keep calm and prep on.

  24. en masse NOT in mass :)

    Sorry, but this is a HUGE pet peeve of mine. Set yourself apart from the majority of alt. media writers. Proofread your writing before presentation to the general public. Thank you.

  25. New here. Interesting thoughts and comments. Several things come to mind for me. Dad is 80. He says we are all screwed because no one knows how to fix things anymore and nothing is made to be fixed anymore. I am inclined to agree with him. The Depression was really bad for some and others had steady work and were okay. My grandfather had his job through the depression and they were okay. My grandmother said don’t keep anything of value in the bank. They stole it all when they closed the banks.
    I think most of the people I know have a garden and a pantry. We learned to have one and have one back. You never run out that way. Put up on bumper years and have a 2 year rotation. That way if you have a bad year, you are okay. Stores closed at night and you couldn’t buy on Sunday so looking ahead was the way then. Now our grocery has cut the 24 hours to 7 am – 9pm. Just heard the walmart also dropped its 24 hours, haven’t heard what the new hours will be. Also there are a lot more bare shelves and empty spots. Prices keep going up and the box gets smaller. Are we already being shown the way we are heading and just not seeing it?
    There’s tariff’s and things are slowly getting scarcer on in-stock. We are being driven by the herd mentality to think this or think that. How about I think for me and you think for you? Or like Dad said, If all your friends were jumping of the bridge, I suppose you would too.
    Time to pull up the boot straps. When the gov. says uh oh, looks like a recession coming, you can be darn sure, they will make sure one comes.

    1. I respectfully disagree and here is why. So many like minded people think they will be islands of tranquility, food and sanity in a sea of madness and you will ride out the storm. Please read Bolshevik history. Then the communists took over Russia they decimated the rural population and in a country the size of Russia you would have thought there was a place to hide—THERE WAS NOT. 30 million people died before the onset of WW2!!!! Today with drones, satellites and hood rats, angry liberals and snitch neighbors that have poured in the suburbs and rural American do you think there is any refuge?

  26. Good evening everyone, been a few rough days for sure.
    I wanted to comment on this Article, actually a couple of comments if I may.

    First of all, I would like to ask exactly what the daily Troll, “An optimist.”, has against Cheetos???? I mean come-on-man…. Nada better than a bag of Xxtra Flamin` Hot Cheetos with a good Gin Martini. So why ya picking on Cheetos???

    Ok, with that done, I want to say I been hanging around MSB for 4-5 years I guess and have read a LOT of Kens articles and quite a few Guest Articles.
    I have got to say this is absolutely one of the finest works Ken has published.
    Well written and a very well thought out format, even saying right up front it’s not meant to offend (except for the Cheetos Hater I guess).

    When I get more time tomorrow I plan on finishing reading all of the fantastic comments, well most anyways An optimist., and add my one cent worth (recession ya know).

    PS; Thank you everyone for keeping this site civil and a GREAT place to converse with likeminded people.
    I mean even Tommyboy has a LOT of good input going on, Thank you buddy, GREAT job.

    1. Thanks, NRP. It just flowed from the fingertips onto the screen. I was just the intermediary.

      1. I second NRP, steady site visitor for multi-years. Rarely stop to comment though. You have consistent thought provoking articles, usually inspiring and always rational. This one and comments is real good, I might try these cheetos?

        1. Thanks “Maine person”. I love it when long-time lurkers poke their heads up once in a while and comment ;)

    2. Agree and did folks see that Steve Quayle picked up this article to his site?

  27. Many great posts here.
    The topic mostly upsetting me is our neighbors if/when anything deprives us of our easy lives.
    Next door, a 21/22 year old, had a cute response about my Berkey….oh, we don’t need one of those, we have a whole house water filter.
    I didn’t even waste my time explaining.

    1. – Couple of things –

      JJ – Don’t worry about it, the child will figure it out * but * it will be too late to do anything about it.

      NRP, nice to hear from you. Hope that you and Blue are both doing better. Hope his surgery went well.

      Ken, yes, I agree that it is nice to hear from the occasional lurker just to remind us that there are a dozen at least lurkers for every poster on the blog. I have to agree, this is a very well-written article and I really don’t have any disagreement with it. I do know that I would not expect any of my co-workers to show up and work for Monopoly money. I fully expect this Urgent Care Clinic where I am working to close. The hospital it is associated with will remain open until until too many staff will not show up for work due to the same problem. Really don’t expect that to be a long time. Lastly, I know that I will be seeing a lot of my neighbors to show up at my door looking for medical help. I will do What I Can, but will be limited by what I have/can spare. Antibiotics? I don’t have enough I can spare. Daily Meds? Sorry, you should have had some put back, I don’t have any of that. There is a lot I can manage, but it will be medicine as done in the old cowboy movies. That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.
      – Papa S.

    2. Papa Smurf don’t downgrade your medical skills like that. Your well past Cowboy medic skills.

      You know about Germs and protecting yourself and others from cross contamination. Hand washing ALWAYS, surgical mask and eye protection for the caregiver and a Surgical Mask ON the Coughing Person. Those alone will do a LOT to prevent Ebola’s spread, let alone even the common flu.

      You know about Medical Isolation and how to prevent a NEW Guest from bringing that nasty “Spanish Flu” or whatever the pathogen of the day is into your camp. Your well aware how a 7-10 day Medical Isolation can prevent your entire family being destroyed by the Plague or such.

      You know why and how to stop most bleeding, CPR and how to treat that deadly killer Diarrhea with Rice Water and serious hydration efforts. You probably know that Mountain Medic trick of using Rectal Retention Lavage with an enema bag to get hydration into a victim that cannot take oral hydration. Messy but useful when you cannot get an IV into someone OR you don’t have an IV to use…

      I bet your well aware of how to use tape and a bit of plastic or a surgical glove finger to create a one way valve to treat a sucking chest wound. You know the Shock Position and how to look for entrance and exit wounds. You know even if it Hurts to place the Wounded Lung DOWN as not to have blood to flow through the bronchi and thus flood the uninjured lung with blood.

      You know why not to give food and fluids orally to a potential bowel wound. A damp cloth to the lips and rectal lavage gently as not to flow into the injured bowels. Sometimes bowel injuries resolve themselves with rest and care. That’s almost how my local hospital treated my recent micro-perforation of the colon as I was not willing to go to surgery yet.

      I could go on but you probably HAVE a Copy of Dr. Alton’s Emergency Medicine and the Basic Medical Knowledge to use that information properly.

      Buddy your medical skills would be welcome at my camp fire.

      1. – me2,
        I am not saying I am not familiar with those techniques and more. You mentioned proctoclysis (Rectal Retention Lavage) at one point. Done properly it is not “messy” and you can, in fact, administer a surprising amount of fluid to someone whose veins are inaccessible. You did not even mention Maggot therapy, and I have seen that as well. That is where fly larvae are used to selectively remove dead tissue from an infected wound on a living person.

        What I am saying is that I do not have unlimited supplies of daily medications or antibiotics. I will do what I can for my neighbors, and I was formally trained in so-called “ditch medicine”. I can do a lot with very little; I will not endanger myself and mine to care for someone who simply “needs” in this circumstance. That may sound unkind. More to the point, if I cannot tend to my and my families needs, including my children whom I would expect to show up, those supplies are simply not available. If someone can get them, of course, I will happily dispense them. At the current time, however, I have to pay for them out of my pocket and my pockets are just not deep enough for my entire community.

        Joe Alton’s book is very nice. I would suggest you find a download (can be had for free), or better yet a paper copy of “Austere Medicine”; Dr. Hugh Coffee’s book, “Ditch Medicine”; a Dorland’s Medical encyclopedia; and an older edition (PRE-1980) of the Merck Manual. (I paid $5 for mine at a second hand book store.)

        Even if you yourself are unable to use these books, they would be invaluable references for whatever medically trained persons you might be able to find in the SHTF. “Emergency War Surgery” and several of the military 91-series TMs and FMs would also be of use, but maybe less so than the previous books.

        None of those books are particularly expensive. The information in then would potentially be priceless. (There are others that would be of use but are expensive in comparison)

        Please understand, it’s not that I would not like to be able to- I just ain’t made of money.

        – Papa

        1. – Correction, not “Austere Medicine”, but, “third Edition of the Survival and Austere Medicine ebook”. My bad, just typing off the top of my head in the middle of the night.
          – Papa

        2. Papa Smurf events in Ebola Land force me to add Security to your Medical Team efforts.

          Used to be folks were Grateful for any decent assistance. 2nd Timothy 3:2 “In the last days people will become lovers of self…arrogant…ungrateful etc.”

          Now I’ve seen in our local hospital times we needed to lock the doors and call the police due to threats against our ER personnel for not taking care of “Fill in the Blank” well enough, promptly enough etc.

          Security is also needed for Medical Isolation or the suspected Sick People may storm your dinner table expecting far better food and treatment.

          Mostly what I prepare for needs not so much money as techniques.

        3. Papa Smurf when I working at Johns Hopkins in Baltimore I saw Maggot Therapy at work AND visited the Maggot Lab that grew them.

          Interesting and effective with non healing wounds esp. bedsores but in an Austere Environment not very practical. They were using medical grade radiation sources to sterilize rotting meat to feed the several generations of progressively cleaner flies-maggots. I doubt I could replicate that process even with Old Homesteaders help (A shout out I miss that old guy!).

          As I have SEEN Fly strike maggots almost destroy undocked sheep that seems not a technique I’d use. Now packing a wound in White Sugar works very well.

        4. me2,
          Please bring OFF-TOPIC conversation (medical advice / maggot therapy, etc,) over to the OPEN-FORUM page. Thanks.

  28. The death toll of a Great Depression 2.0 would be around 60 million to be conservative. It would come in waves. The chaos from hood rats would cost a few million lives including their own. However, when the average joe does not have beer and cable t.v. he will be just as dangerous. Add this to neighbor killing neighbor and eventually the government gaining the upper hand–a lot of people will be killed. Also, if a depression happens and anarchy reigns—look for a combined invasion of Russian and Chinese troops to help the American government under the guise of securing our nuclear stockpile.

  29. @chevy.
    With a blog like this…..I need a bigger data plan. Lol😉 And a better 4g connection.

  30. Are we forgetting the Great Depression dragged on for years because of the way the it was handled. The next depression could be over very quickly if handled correctly. It could be over in a matter of months. Simply create a new currency backed by gold. All assets collapse & all debt disappears. These will be rough months but quick. If managed correctly there could be an ordered recovery. All we need a leader with bankruptcy experience. Who could that be?

    1. Gold would 20.000 per ounce and out of the reach of nearly one. The only solution politicos will come up with ‘FedCoin’ cashless e currency. I agree in spirit my friend but sanity cannot prevail when dealing with dealing with little Stalins like AOC or even Pelosi…..

  31. Thought provoking article. Thanks Ken.

    What led to the Great Depression, including the timeline of the slide, is still the subject of much debate. Concurrent was the 10 year long drought that caused the Dust Bowl which severely impacted 27 states and drove 2-1/2% of the population from the middle of the country to the West Coast.

    Now, most of our 3x larger population lives on the coasts and in the great cities of the Midwest. There’s no place for anyone to go. And why would they? Federal and state assistance is set up to benefit the most people in the smallest space. Charities are set up along the same lines. This conserves logistical resources. Recent guv planning in the event of long-term regional or national catastrophe is to have folks shelter in place at home and receive distributed supplies in central locations.

    When we talk about the guv printing money do we consider the electronic loading of EBT cards? After the 2008 recession, would the guv take steps to keep people in their homes, even if they couldn’t pay? Were lessons learned? We already have a number of municipalities that are bankrupt. We need to remember that it’s not just the fed guv we’ll have to contend with. Most states and some municipalities assess income taxes; and most jurisdictions assess property, sales, “sin”, business, gas, road, unemployment, licensing, and other taxes. Unions take their cut where they can.

    We’re seeing stumbles right now in those areas that have mandated a minimum wage significantly higher than the fed minimum. Business are closing, or moving, or drastically cutting staff and staff hours, or becoming more automated, like all the McDonald’s here. With fewer businesses or employees to tax, will expenditures be lowered, or taxes increased on others?

    Besides the threats of political shenanigans, determined terrorism, and international sabre-rattling, we have had devastating weather this past season. 2019 is the shift from solar cycle 24 to 25. The 2018-2019 and 2019-2020 winters herald the beginning of a 35 year long solar minimum. NASA says we’re currently experiencing the lowest level of solar activity in 200 years. There are predictions that 2028 through 2032 will be relatively dark, cold years where food production will be reduced due to cosmic forces. Each and all of these will negatively impact the economy no matter how well it’s doing otherwise.

    I think that we have a much more complex and robust economy than we did a hundred years ago. It is vulnerable however and even if all current indicators prove false, five years of bad weather a decade from now may certainly strain our national resiliency. Electing libsiders with their promises to bankrupt the nation in record time will tip us off that cliff very quickly.

    Wouldn’t wish hard times on anyone, but sure looks like they’re already here for some, like elderly residents of the inner cities, and coming for many more of us.

    Keeping Calm and Prepping On

  32. Gold and Silver!!! Get it while you can,if you can.Fractionals are best. lm serious.

  33. If I had a dollar for every doomsday prediction that never came true I’d be very
    wealthy right about now..Y2K, 2012 the end of the world along with numerous others.
    But, maybe someday, after all even a broken clock is right twice a day.

    1. No doubt JT on the predictions. This isn’t meant as one or I don’t take it that way. It’s just a discussion on thoughts. Seen and heard a ton of predictions since the 70s

  34. I received access to a very high-level intel briefing during the 3rd quarter of last year.
    They said this is what is coming;
    1. the 2018 election would be very divisive, the govt would be more divided (and it was).
    2. This would get worse leading to the 2020 election (and it is).
    3. It will become so divisive, before, during or just after the 2020 election, the Govt will cease.
    4. The president (whoever that is) will be forced to declare martial law.
    5. The US military is fully aware and is making plans to prepare for massive domestic chaos.
    6. There will be war in the Middle east. There are desperate plans also to stop WW III.
    7. There will be an extended time of global unrest (worse ever) many people will die.
    8. There will be life after this and it will be the NWO.

  35. A thought provoking article Ken.

    The last time I survived an economic downturn, I ended up relocating from the area of the world that I grew up in and I gave up my connections to local farms and ranches when I moved away.

    In my new home, I am establishing social and work connections with local farmers and ranchers by training and working with the children of the farmers and ranchers. I still work in the medical field and I see myself having to work for food or eggs as opposed to a strict cash-only exchange rate during times of recession.

    In recent years, I have worked on or fixed rifles or shotguns for farmers and ranchers as favors or in exchange for meat, eggs or produce. My ancestors that survived the Great Depression did much the same thing: working on another person’s ranch or farm for food to take home as opposed to cash outlay.

    The scariest thing about the last recession for me was: The depth of the damage and how widespread the damage was. Several of my siblings lost their homes and I must say, I was not surprised by that news.

    My own reaction to a governor that was going to stop paying me cash and give me IOU’s instead was the acronym of: F.E.A.R. roughly translated to mean: F$ck Everything And Run. Thus my handle on this here website: Calirefugee.

    The scenario that Ken described where the entire planet goes to sh%t and there are no more greener pastures? You are talking a Mad Max world or the last days of Quadafi in Libya or Mogadishu. I cannot say I would be lucky enough to survive.

    If I was lucky enough to survive, I can see myself working convoy security on a vehicle carrying the only cargo I have working knowledge of: drugs.

    I would like to recommend several movies about recessions . My favorite movie as of late was: The Big Short. As Ben Rickert said in the movie: Do not dance about betting against the US economy. People lose jobs, people lose pensions and hundreds of thousands of people die.

    Yes, the outlook for a downturn in the near future is looking increasingly certain. I do hope that our institutions will remain standing afterwards or I may have to become a refugee again if I live through the initial outburst of violence..

  36. A fall is coming for America, With all the American people on the band wagon of the gov will take care of me.. Are in for a shock. When the curtain falls, the elect grid will fall also. Cities will be in ruin in a week. Give it a month and the population will be smaller. Nursing Homes will be looted and burned, (useless eaters) in the eyes of the mobs. After 3 months, a very small population will be in America. Then the Blue Hats will come. Americans who are left will be tried in fire and will not tolerate this. War on the spot. After a month the Russians and Chinese will come for the spoils. There will be a very small area to occupy… The nuclear power plants will have melted down by then.

  37. A Random thought while sipping coffee.

    There is a LOT going on Politically-Financially (But I REPEAT myself). It reminds me of a Carnival scene. All the side shows, bright look at ME signs and all that.

    Remember what the GOAL of the Carnival is:

    To KEEP you Distracted to the outrageous Cost of the Hotdogs, Entertained UNTIL your BROKE, Tired and likely Sunburnt-food poisoned (indigestion anyone?) and SEND you Home to get you Back to WORK until the next Carnival.

    Is the Current Media much different? Bread and Circuses kept the Mobs occupied in Rome. EBT and America’s Got Talent today?

    A lot of distractions, a lot of moving parts. How can you tell what a Politician is really going to do? Listen to what he/she/it says the Other Person is doing…..

    Emmanuel Rham (once Obama’s Chief of Staff and Chicago’s Mayor) said “Never let a good crisis go to waste”.

    Distractions, smoke and mirrors, get us to hate each other so THEY can do what they planned all along.

    1. Thats why you have your olive barrels though isnt it M?
      All we seem to have are distractions, the funny thing is most keep pivoting on every single different one and forget what was going on a few days ago. Notice how the national news outlets lately seem like they have ADHD,,,,
      Wonder what these things are distracting from? Gun laws? Economy flop? Government corruption?
      I find it interesting how so called smart people dont see this crap, maybe they really are not so smart.

      1. Kulafarmer I LIKE having Options friend. Having a plan B Olive barrel and maybe in your case some yams planted where you might hide out and go fishing in your nearly perfect climate (Lucky Dog!) until the great die off occurs.

        1. Actually that one spot that would be my first choice if i had to run, has frost on the ground every morning for a few months out of the year,,,
          But the view is incredible if ya get my drift,,,
          It does have water though as well as cover and shelter and a pretty good sprinkling of game. If i had to be homeless or on the run, much preferable to being amongst the masses. Even if it were just a place to go and die, i would rather kneel in judgement there alone on the mountain than be flopped into a mass grave

        2. Thanks for the chuckle Ken!

          While you can use whatever you choose the used olive barrel is cheap, water proof if you still have the gasket with the screw top. Food Safe plastic. Non metallic so no rust issues and less of a signature for “Treasure Hunters”.

          Reusable after you dig it up and use the contents as maybe a 40 gallon Water Barrel (Got a Tarp and some cordage to collect rain friend)? Maybe with some PVC fittings a Slow Sand Filter for safe use of rain water (I have one barrel with the makings of a slow sand filter stored INSIDE the Olive Barrel, maybe I need 2 of them)? Maybe as a Root Cellar for storage given the need to keep food cool and dry?

          I have tested two of them as the basis of an emergency Bivvy bag given the HARSH Nature of NH Winter storms. Need shelter FAST sometimes. Worked pretty well with a closed cell foam sleeping pad, sleeping bag, wool blanket, bug netting, cordage and a 10′ x 15′ tarp. The wool blanket was most useful for additional padding for my back and a pillow.

          Plus if an out of shape 60 year old can handle hiding them under things No Soldier will want to dig in then most of us should be able to handle it.

          I can buy 5 gallon buckets and lids of maybe food grade plastic from anywhere for about 6-8 dollars each. The good ones seal well, the Wally World not so much. I can buy an Olive Barrel currently for about 18 dollars. They ARE Food Safe, They SEAL well, they are very stout construction, you cannot crush them by sitting on their sides, and they hold MUCH larger items like dry packed “Tools”. Your good at math, 40 divided by 5 = 8each 5 gallon buckets…..

        3. me2
          What do you use to clean the olive barrels? On the pickle barrels I use pool shock to clean and remove the smell.

        4. Matt the ones I pick up are pretty darn clean already. I just put a few gallons of water some Dawn and slosh around for 15 minutes. Rinsing take the most time. Someday I keep promising myself I’ll set up a couple of sawhorses and 2 X 4’s so I can just spray UP into them. Air dry as needed.

          As I tend to buy only two at a time (limit is my Vehicle) that Wash Rack never seems to happen :-).

          I like Dawn because it’s cheap, effective and thus far has never harmed my lawn or flower bed.

          As a Side Note IF you happen to need to Mylar Bag some “tools” notice if you cut one side and the bottom of the bag it makes QUITE a Long Bag for “Tools” when you seal that bag long way around. Just remember to Dry Pack them with desiccant and pad the sharp bits as not to puncture the Mylar. This Spring I unpacked one of my Squirrel “Tools” and it was pristine. Didn’t even have to re-zero it when I used it on some Red Squirrels.

  38. And then there is this headline from Foxnews:
    Yellowstone ‘supervolcano’ eruption would be catastrophic, NYT op-ed says

  39. Excellent article! Quite thought provoking. When I think about the attitude, abilities and even the overall strength and health of our grandparents who lived through the great depression compared to the average young person today it’s staggering! There was a study done a number of years ago stating that the average high school or college age male in America isn’t fit enough to meet the minimum fitness requirements for military acceptance. How scary is that?? Probably half the population even in the 20-40 age range simply is not strong enough to survive. Thank you for your perspective, sadly, I think you’re right on the $$$!

    1. And it actually goes beyond that. My brother is in the reserves and was one of the first to be in the “new” training. He called it a cakewalk. So if it’s so easy, that average is even lower than most people suspect.

  40. Just for a baseline in the discussion over how may would die in a great depression, in 2017, their were 2,813,503 deaths from all causes in the U.S. This number is in line with the average number of deaths each year.

  41. All this being said, that’s exactly why I’m living where I am, and why I moved here about 50 years ago, from frigid New England.
    ‘ The Sea Is My Bounty .’

    1. That is so true,,,
      I can go 20 minutes south of my home and be at a rocky shoreline, no sand but in every tide pool or on every rock there is something to catch or scrape and eat,,, not to mention what awaits for those with pole, line and hook,,,
      No limits either

    1. Gray One

      Are you kidding? Even our worst experience in a depression would still be better than the crap holes the third world has created and refused to improve. America will still be the magnet for illegals. Clean water, clean air, natural forested areas, wild game, freedoms, …

  42. Anyone ever play Jenga? I get the feeling(aided by much reading and speculation) that we are in for an interesting game of Jenga on a global scale. When Jenga occurs we will probably not recognize it until after the fact: ebola in the homeless of LA, major bank fail, president Trump in 2020, grid down, china calling on US to payup on all the securities they own? All possible, but maybe a foreign actor will start it. Write your own guess and plan for it, then add plan B and maybe C…It isn’t as if there aren’t overlaps in preparations. The most important part is to not stick out when/while you are prepping, that makes you a target of the people who don’t prep but feel you should “share”. As in “It’s yours but I’ve got it/want it/will take it for the ‘common’ good.”

  43. Ken, great article, and based on the number of replies – many well thought-out and passionate – I’d say this is a hot topic… thank you!

    As some of you may know from other threads, I am a professional number-cruncher. A serious economic downturn or even collapse is one of the things I have done some prep for. Since none of us can predict when or how severe the next downturn will be, it makes sense to prepare for worst-case scenarios the best we can.

    Could we go into a full-blown depression – of course we could! And I agree that in many ways it could be worse than the Great Depression. We now have about $22.4 trillion in debt and growing daily. Our population is where now? 320 million? 330? That’s $70k + apiece!

    And think about how many mouths we would need to feed. During the 1st depression there were 88-100 million people here – (depending on which year you look at) so we are more than triple that.

    One of the bellweather statistics on economic condition is the ratio of national debt to GDP. During the depression, we ran about 12% debt to GDP, which grew to about 15% in prep for WW2. During WW2 we ran about 35%. Today, we are somewhere around 105-106%, depending on whose reports you read. And, with the Fed manipulations to our economy, and some never-Trumpers actually rooting for a recession, who knows what will happen?

    Because our economy is SO consumer-spending driven, any major blip can start a chain reaction. Once people stop spending (out of work, EBT benefits stopped or cut, even fear of a big downturn) can be enough to trigger a series of events.

    This concern was one of the factors leading toward selling our small business last year. Now, at least we have zero debt (personal or business) and can weather a bad downturn.
    If a full-blown depression hits I would expect very high unemployment, instability in prices, heavy mortgage defaults, lack of confidence in the dollar and thus a flight out of our stocks and bonds, and bank failures. It gets worse from there. Supply chain disruptions would lead to shortages of the worst kinds.

    And the FDIC cannot possibly cover all funds on deposit if we had major bank failures, so the . G o v would have to step in. But who would buy the debt issued to create more liquidity – cash flow – to cover the banks? If it gets that far we are in real trouble.

    With a smart business man as president, I am hopeful it doesn’t happen. But (here comes my tin hat) it’s clear there are people in power who are so threatened by this administration they could very well tank our economy just to prevent a second term.

    For those who posted that these things are doomsday predictions that could never happen, I urge you to at least consider the effects of a very bad downturn and get your finances in order. Pay off debt, live below your means, keep some extra supplies on hand, drive your vehicle a little longer. And don’t think it can NEVER happen here – because it very well could!

  44. My feeling is that we will see a downturn in the economy with a severity similar to Rawls Patriots.
    City’s will become a heck of a good place to stay away from!
    People who are already trying to live a self sufficient life may be hungry but survive.
    All of us here come because we support each other!
    Until the electric power and the internet go out we will still have that. Till then prep as we can, keep your faith in God,your thanks to Ken for MSB,and last a smile on your face in the face of adversity!

  45. Ken Thank You for the very well written article. I think that you have encapsulated what many of us have been pondering for some time. I’m prepped but somehow after reading Selco talk about his life in Bosnian Hell during the War I don’t really think any of us are Truly Prepared. While I don’t claim to be Christian I do Pray to Jesus for PEACE. I recently started reading The Old Testament again starting with the very Beginning: Genesis & as I continue through each succeeding Book I see how Far Mankind has Strayed Away from GOD. Sadly I think We will All Pay for these acts of Continuing Disrespect & Disobedience to GOD. Your Families Survival Will Surely Depend on FAITH IN GOD, Skills & Prep & Some Kind of Community & Fellowship but Pray for Peace & Prepare for WAR.

  46. America love it or leave it!
    I’m already gone, left two years ago.
    Moved to an undisclosed country.
    Mostly agricultural, 90% of all are Catholic.
    Lose gun regulations and outside the city’s
    everybody is off the grid. Solar panels are very
    popular. It’s two boat rides to the big city.
    So when or if the sky falls I’ll watch it on my satellite
    TV. Don’t be late evacuate!


  47. I was sure that we would be in a depression back in 2008 and here we are talking about the fear of what could be in 2019.

    Right now the rest of the world has negative interest rates and the US of A has positive savings rates. The world currency is moving here. If Europe or China falls first, we could be in the industry of feeding them more debt. This would kick the can down the road for another 10 years. Then we could sell them more weapons, credit and drama because that is what we do well. Credit and drama are renewable resources, and we excel at selling the drama on credit.

    1. @not so sure,
      We indeed were on the precipice in 2008. In my opinion (what do I know?) they should have let it go then. Instead they doubled-down. And now the system is incredibly systemically worse off in my opinion. The amount of QE that went out into the world is staggering. And only a fraction has come back.

      I understand your reasoning in your second paragraph. And of course, it could happen. The thing is though, the geo/economic landscape is different now than 2008 in many ways. One of which is Russia/China have bypassed the dollar system. Or better said, there is a system in place to bypass SWIFT and the dollar. We (the U.S.) can’t just go in and kick their a$$ like the MIC has done in the past with other nations who jump off the bandwagon. Anyway, it’s complicated. I just read and digest. Sometimes I think I would be better off to stick my head in the sand and revert to my cocoon. But the problem is, once you take the Red pill, there’s no going back.

      1. China lost their chance to be the new world currency when they chose to devalue theirs. Not like they did in 2015, but letting the band slip to favor themselves. No one is going to make them the new standard now. They have shown that they will wantonly manipulate their currency, or let their own businesses do it themselves, to suit themselves at a whim.

        The Yuan is a tiny piece of the world reserve currency. I wouldn’t worry about it until it catches up to the big 3.

        No one is going to trust Russia after the next time they nationalize an industry.

        I don’t think anyone wants to use the US Dollar as the standard. It’s just the least worst option.

  48. Psalm 144:15 Happy is that people, that is in such a case: yea, happy is that people, whose God is the LORD. (KJV)

    Well now, are YOU happy about what’s coming?
    So … go figure … and you do the math!

    (Doesn’t cause and effect always win in the end?)

  49. My mother, several years ago (she’s gone now), spent some time writing her thoughts about growing up. She was born in 1933, so many of those thoughts were from life on the farm and growing up in the depression.

    She wrote these thoughts out in cursive. Well, as some here may know, children today are not taught cursive anymore. When I showed mom ‘s little story to my 11yr old granddaughter and asked her if she could read it- -she couldn’t.

    That really bothered me, that she couldn’t read her great grandmother’s story about her life.

    So, I have begun to type it out so if they ever really want to know about their great-grandma, they will be able to read her life story.

    All this to say, I’m now working on the part about how they lived thru the depression. I agree with Ken for the most part. People have no idea how to make ends meet when they are homeless/jobless. My mom’s grandparents lived in Iowa, on a dairy farm, and ran a small grocery/bakery in a suburb of Sioux City, Iowa.

    They worked HARD. From before sun up to 1am every day, all day, every week all year long. Only on Christmas day did they open the store late. This was during the depression. Her dad was a builder and plasterer. He followed jobs even to Chicago and then finally had to come home (to Leeds, Iowa) because there was NO MORE work. They never left again.

    I’m glad many here have taken it back to the land. It will keep us alive. It kept my mom and family alive. I often heard her say, we never knew hunger. It was because of their farm life. Most people will be in a world of hurt this next time around.

    1. Oh so very true. I don’t think I will survive it. I have COPD because i got hooked on those C-rat cigarettes the Army used to give us. Now the Amazon is burning and we might loose 20% of our oxygen making capacity in the world. As a person with chronic lung disease I have not been able to figure out how to live in an atmosphere of 16% oxygen down from the normal 21% and hey maybe my math is off by a bit but you know what I mean.

      What the hell, it’s been a good run.

  50. This will not be popular but climate change is real and food insecurity via supply shortages and/or exorbitantly high prices will occur. Whether people believe it is natural or man-made, it is real. Prepping is normal for disasters such as floods, ice storms, tornadoes, power outages, etc. I am trying to increase my supply of canned goods, have at least 2 manual can openers, have several suitcases on wheels in case I need to evacuate, live in a condo apartment with mostly retired persons/older workers with a live in superintendent who came through for us when my city had a tornado less than one year ago. My building is not wood frame but concrete. Most of the buildings damaged in the last tornado in my city were wood frame and these are more vulnerable to fire whether accidental or deliberate (think raging gangs intent on vandalism). We have an informal area in the garage where people put things they do not want which are free for others to take if they can use them. My condo building is working on an emergency preparedness plan. Our building was broken into last autumn by a druggie who went for the garage and locker rooms where he smashed windows of several cars looking for items and broke into 21 lockers. We have increased security and have a group policy of if you see something say something, to the superintendent or if a crime in progress call 911. I consider my condo to be my nation as its governing body reflects my values (whereas the larger society does not). I live on a floor that I can access without the elevators in case of a power failure, but do not live on the ground/first floor. I wear neutral clothes including grey, black, navy and medium blue and I keep my more colorful clothes to wear inside my unit. I try to shop just after work as it is still light out but not crowded. I live less than 3 miles from my office. I dress as a boring older menopausal woman but do not look frail and I notice things in the neighborhood. I avoid crowds but am at an age where I do not go to entertainment (movies, clubs). I watch my movies at home and go to restaurants infrequently, for convenience and do not stay there long. I do not engage strangers in conversation but am friendly with store clerks. Due to my age I am not concerned with general street harassment/catcalls but I am cognizant of purse snatching risks so I take precautions. I do not wear tight or revealing clothing and my skirts are just below my knees. Obviously I have no writing, suggestive or political comments on any clothing or purse/tote that I carry. I am your boring mother whose brain is fogged by menopause, to the young hip crowd. Thus, most people leave me alone. The gist of this is that sticking to one’s own broad demographic is safer, be it a combination of age, beliefs and values, ethnic group or religious affiliation. My condo would never tolerate the college frat crowd. Party time is more like a group playing cards or bridge in the party room or celebrating a senior’s birthday. No drunkenness, drug dealing, fights in the hallways, vomiting due to drunkenness, passing out due to intoxication, flying of the balcony (literally) due to hallucinogenic substances. Yes we get drugs delivered to the condo but they are for the seniors from the pharmacy and on prescription. Our super is nosy in a good way. Air B and B is NOT permitted and units can only be rented to families including spouses, parents/children, siblings, etc. No groups of unrelated room-mates who rotate every few months. As society becomes more divided, at work I maintain a boring older lady persona. I do not discuss divisive politics. I do talk about doing the laundry and other subjects that bore most people. Young people are taking over my work place and it caters to them now as if they are the best generation to have ever been born as they are “so progressive”. I will retire in a few years but will just fill in my papers and slide out as by then I will be a minority regarding age. Most people I used to know have since retired. Of course I have to take the learning courses that are considered politically correct. Some people just log in, let the course run, and go to the washroom on a long bathroom break. When they come back to their work pod, the course has finished, and sometimes an e-certificate is ready to download. The only place I feel empowered is in my condo building as most people are 55 plus, although it is not a seniors’ condo. As society becomes so polarized, hateful and violent, I just dis-engage. I consider myself to be on sabbatical from society. People drive like maniacs on the cusp of violence, so when in a vehicle I do not give them eye contact. It is an honor to be considered boring.

    1. Sunset…You seem to be doing all you can to survive whatever comes your way in your condo. Can I suggest that you start preparing for heaven by reading your Bible, if you aren’t already. God Bless

  51. Most people simply cannot imagine a mass catastrophe like this happening, even when faced with the facts, myself included, because we’ve never had such a catastrophe happen in our life. The great depression, world wars, etc are all just history we read about in books, and filed away in our brains as “things that don’t happen anymore, because times have changed”. And that disbelief makes such a catastrophe 100x more dangerous, because so many people aren’t prepared to survive a few days let alone several years.

    Because I am a weekend prepper, I do have some skills, knowledge, gear, and food which would allow me to survive short term. I am also constantly learning more, and when finances permit, aquiring useful supplies. So my odds of survival are continually improving. But as it stands at present, I’m not prepared for a depression, or any other long term catastrophe.

  52. Lets start at the beginning. The beginning before or after action vis a vis Trump is inmaterial. Economies do what they do based on the economics not administrations. Second even so, Trump wins again. Not because he is great but because his opposition sucks.

    But there are two scenarios:

    A) Flash crash. All hell in a handbasket in the blink of an eye. And over just as quickly. Most of the posters here are thinking Thunderdome when in reality it bows out like a wimper. Remember the rules of 3 — 3 minutes to last breath, 3 days to last drink, 3 weeks to last meal. Simply put one can expect that half the population or more will be dead in a month. Another quarter within 3 months. There is simply not enough time to gain the skills to survive/forage/maintain in that period of time for most of the population. So its chaos for about a week, maybe two then its the murmurs of ‘bring out your dead’. (And I have not even mentioned infectious diseases…)

    Imagine a skeleton holding a cellphone that reads — “Uber Eats delivery in …”.

    B) Muddle Thru. There is just a slow breakdown in social and civil infrastructure. Folks we are already in THIS ONE. Chicago had 7 deaths and 28 wounded alone this Labor Day weekend. LA is littered in trash and has the threat of Thyphus. San Fran, you have to tip toe around the needles just to get to work. The simple fact of the matter is that the NeoLiberal policies don’t work because these very same cities have been run by Democrats for 50 years straight. Proof enough.

    Presumptive that the NeoLiberal/Socialists win in 2024 they take the big city ‘solutions’ national. Matters just continually degrade to the point we reach a John Galt like environment. Global trade is but a 10th of what it was previously. Dollars do become dear if they exist at all, BTC probably having more value.

    The only saving grace in this scenario is that more people survive because they have time to adjust and gain some skills over the timeframe.

    Keep in mind that what appears abnormal to the current generation, become ‘business as usual’ to the next.

    1. I was discussing this the other day. A couple of possibilities–burning (cremation) becomes necessary, every bit of land is used for cemeteries (probably not, that land will be needed for food production) or mass pit burials.

  53. If it gets bad, the governments of the world will launch World War III. WWII will be their model. It’s commonly believed that WWII got us out of the Great Depression. While this is a wrong belief, the bureaucrats in the Deep State believe it, and they will premise their next world conflict on it.

    The seeds of conflict with Russia and China have been sown. They are being carefully watered and cultivated so that war can be launched when it is deemed advantageous or needful.

    I work with my hands. I do painting, pressure washing, and deck staining. But there will be no demand for such work in such an economic meltdown. My business is fatally flawed in that it relies primarily upon university professors who in turn get their incomes from the government. I’ve attempted to change my line of work and diversify but nothing has come of it. Providence keeps sending me back to painting.

    On the bright side, I rent a house on a farm. The land has been in the family for over 100 years. They raise cows and sheep. Many of families in the valley recall how things were done by hand. That knowledge can be resurrected locally.

    1. Offshore guy you WORK with your Hands. That’s not a weakness. Knowing your strengths and weaknesses makes you far ahead of those who do not look in the mirror honestly.

      You can’t fix what you refuse to acknowledge. That said.

      For a small amount of money you can start raising chickens and rabbits. You could ask permission to plant some berries or grapes or? Start a good garden, BUY Seeds! and salvage some windows to make cold frames? I bet if you asked there is a lot of good salvage materials you see your “Richer” employers needing to dispose of them. Raking unwanted leaves BUT NOT Roundup (Scott yard) treated ones to make compost is a great money cheap, labor only garden improver.

      A few clean garbage cans full of feed corn and a way to crack it (Cast Iron Grinder set plates loose) is likely to become far more important in the near future if the USDA’s planting reports is correct and or an Early Frost of more bad weather destroys more of our corn crop. Feeds chickens, and if treated with clean white wood ash and water makes Masa a very tasty Mexican corn meal. Masa plus dried beans (also cheap and easy to store) makes up the bulk of most Mexican peoples meals. Easy to have 2K worth of healthy calories/protein for less than 2 dollars a day.

      A way to turn scrap wood into heat by a home made heater? Maybe look up charcoal burning for even more value in trade? YouTube and your willingness to work with your hands with even Harbor Freight level tools can do a lot.

      Move forward friend! Help old folks, often I get more in shared knowledge and old stuff than money from helping others. Friends are most valuable when times get tough.

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