One Year Food Storage

Long Term Storage Food For 1 Year – How Much Food Is That?

Guest post by ‘Anony Mee’

Ken’s recent post “15 Reasons Why You Need Food Storage” called to mind an earlier post “Bare Minimum Food Storage List For One Year” which was based on the LDS recommendations for one person for one year of 755 total pounds of various long-term storage food, broken into seven categories.

I’ve been wanting to calculate what it takes to establish a pantry of long-term storage food. The recommended amounts of pounds per year for each category of food made me wonder, “How much food is that?”

So, I broke down each category a bit, calculated amounts of uncooked ingredients, calories, and grams of protein for a cooked amount of each food and built a matrix.

It’s not too granular, but does provide close to the LDS-recommended pounds per year.

>> LDS Preparedness Manual by Christopher Parrett
(view on amzn)

Note: The manual is not an official publication of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. The numbers quoted in this article are not declarations of The Church, merely recommendations by some of its members.

 
Here’s what I came up with:

Grains = 400 lbs per year

Whole grains (wheat, rye, buckwheat, etc.), flours, cold cereals, hot cereals, pasta, noodles, popcorn, yeast bread, quick bread, flat bread, crackers, pastries, coatings, thickeners, snacks, misc. whole grain dishes

Daily: 8-10 slices of bread, 1-1/2 cups cooked pasta, 2 cups cooked rice, 1 cup cooked oatmeal, 4 cups popped popcorn, AND 1/2 cup misc.

[ Read: How Much Wheat In A 5 Gallon Bucket – Pounds, Calories, Loaves Of Bread ]

Beans & Legumes = 90 lbs per year

Dried beans of all sorts, split peas, lentils

Daily: 3/4 cup cooked beans, 2/3 cup cooked lentils, AND 3 tablespoons cooked split peas

[ Read: Rice & Beans, A Survival Combination ]

Milk & Dairy = 75 lbs per year

Powdered/Instant dry milk for drinking, baking, cooking, and gravies; freeze-dried cheese

Daily: 2-1/2 cups reconstituted nonfat milk, AND 1/4 cup reconstituted cheddar cheese

[ Read: DIY Long Term Food Storage ]

Meat = 20 lbs per year

Freeze dried beef, chicken, pork, turkey

Daily: 3 tablespoons reconstituted ground beef, AND 1/4 cup reconstituted chicken chunks

[ Read: Freeze Dried Ground Beef ]

Fats = 20 lbs per year

Oils, butter, shortening, lard, bacon grease – all kept frozen – for cooking, baking, dressings and sauces

Daily: 2 tablespoons olive oil

[ Read: Round Out Your Food Storage After Basic Goods Are Laid In ]

Sugars = 60 lbs per year

Granulated sugar, powdered sugar, honey, molasses, syrups, jam/jelly, candy

Daily: 1-1/2 tablespoons of dry sugar, AND 2-1/2 tablespoons of honey

[ Read: Raw Honey For Nutrition and Medicine ]

Fruit & vegetables = 90 lbs per year

Freeze-dried fruit, freeze-dried vegetables, instant potatoes (mashed, cubed, hash browns)

Daily: 1-1/4 cups reconstituted fruit, 1-1/4 cups reconstituted vegetables, AND 1+ cup cooked potatoes

[ Read: You Won’t Be Eating Much (or any) Meat After SHTF ]


This all yields around 3,500 calories per day, a little on the high side for what we need, based on the family’s anticipated levels of exertion.

This matrix is simply a guide that I’ll adjust along the way.

Here’s the spreadsheet:
one-year-long-term-storage-food-lds.xls

The LDS recommendations are fine, but I can tell you that I’ll be planning to store less grain, legumes, and fruit, more meat, oil, and vegetables, and much more cheese. A reflection of our preferences, and because I am concerned that excessive flatulence might yield undesired results within the community (hee hee).

Including columns for desired amounts, inventory on hand, and cost per unit will give me a budget and a therefore a timeline for accomplishing my long-term food storage goal.

MORE FOOD NEEDED?
More would be needed to help provide for unexpected arrivals, supplement neighbors, and afford handouts to a few strangers who show up at the door now and then.

ADDITIONAL FOOD DIVERSITY
In addition would be long-term storage staples for my family/group of FD peanut butter, grains for making sprouts, FD eggs, and FD sausage crumbles (just gotta have those biscuits and gravy).

Plus grains, eggs/meat, oil, and veg for homemade pet food. Also, yeast and other leavenings, salts, spices, herbs, flavorings, vinegars, various condiments and sauces or their component ingredients, including extra oil for mayonnaise, and tomato powder for ketchups and sauces.

And ingredients for canning, preserving, and processing the garden, orchard, and other food sources, and gluten-free grains for one DFM.

Reconstituting and cooking all these ingredients would take at least a gallon of water per person per day.

NUTRITIONAL SOURCE
A more detailed breakdown of nutrition for each food can be found at any number of websites. The one I used for most of these was nutritionix.com. For freeze-dried meat, cheese, and all fruit and vegetable equivalents, I relied on ThriveLife’s nutritional labels.

– Anony Mee

[Ken adds:] There are a bazillion ways to go about long term storage food for one year. When I first started serious planning years ago I came across the LDS Preparedness Manual which was one of the many references that guided me towards what I have today.

I believe the key to successful long term food storage is a diversity of many food types.

It’s surprising how much food it is when you consider 1 year!

[ Read: Survival Food Most Common In Preppers Deep Pantry Storage ]

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120 Comments

      1. bill posters & Ken;
        OMG, could you imagine the TP storage needed if 90 pounds a DAY!!!!
        Is 600 rolls really enough?

        HAHAHAHA, sorry, just got a chuckle out of that…. Tis a good day :-)

    1. Ohhhh, all that fiber going through the system. That’s a lot of time spent in the latrine. That translates to a very high TP usage. Hehe

      1. That’s a very good point. Often overlooked and underplanned.
        You can have the best long term food pantry. You and yours can eat like Royalty for a year. But whatcha gonna do…whatcha gonna do with all that poo?
        Believe me. The luggable loo bucket won’t be so love able after about a week of lugging the loo.
        We may have thousands of dollars of food stored. But having a safe/sanitary long term 4 season place to deposits that food after we’ve ( cough cough ) processed that food is priceless!!💩💲

  1. ohh and a great site with nice posters i live in Wales so have never posted but read every day

    bill posters is innocent :)

    1. bill posters

      My mother’s father’s people came over from Wales. A few years ago I was blessed to be able to visit that green and glowing homeland. Glad you’re with us.

  2. My estimation is – a family of four needs about the floor area of a three bedroom house to store all the preps (food, clothing, toiletries, etc) for a two year supply. I have been in a couple of LDS homes to be shown the entire basement level of each used for their two year supply. So, what am I getting at? Prepping also includes the space needed for this purpose and in most cases this space needs to be environmentally controlled. Little wonder I am running out of room.

    1. Which is one reason that most of my “storage” is outside, growing in the dirt. Fruit trees, bushes, the main garden, grapes–yes, they contribute each year, but they are also things I can mostly rely on to supplement for the next year. I have considerably more than a year stored, but there’s no way I can store sufficient to feed us as well as other family members who might show up. Much of our external “storage” is given away each year, but if we needed it we’d have it.

    2. hernit us;
      Having talked to an LDS Bishop, they are now asking their people to have 7 years of storage.
      Something about the 7 year famine or something like that.
      So imaging the space needed for 2 year and increase that to 7 years…..

      1. Yes, I’m headed in that direction myself. But, I have to diversify my storage locations to reduce the risks, fire, theft, bears, … Wish there was some way to better hide some grain bins – too big a target.

        1. hermit us;
          Ever seen those Plastic Septic Tanks?
          Bury one, 3 feet to top, build the “normal” cleanout rings to ground level or 1 foot above install lader. Build a shed over it with some ventilation pipes for concealment, and poof, you have a Root Cellar.
          100% rodent proof from underground, water tight, fairly large (1000 gallon) and who in their right mind would look in a Septic Tank for your food stash?

          1. NRP
            Good comment. I have been in some and installed some. They are not really that big. Usually about 5′ wide, 8′ long, 7′ high so using just food buckets – perhaps 50 may fit. Not bad for bucket storage, but jars, cans, bags, … on shelves – not very efficient especially for foods that need to be rotated. High walls and a bunker looking better every day.

          2. For NRP and Dennis
            Plastic septic tanks have one limiting factor – you have to be of a diameter to be able to get into them. :) :)

      2. NRP,

        The LDS bishop was probably referring to the book of Genesis (chapter 41 I believe) when Joseph was sold into slavery by his jealous brothers, and later became an esteemed adviser to Egypt’s pharaoh. He predicted 7 years of plenty, followed by seven years of famine, advising that during the years of good harvests they should store up for those seven years of famine. His advice saved not only the Egyptians, but also Joseph’s family who migrated in search of food due to the famine. I believe the LDS folks use both the Old and New Testament Bible in addition to the Book of Mormons.

        1. If you read the account in Genesis chapter 48: 13-21 , of the famine in Egypt during Joseph’s time you will see what happened to the people without food . They lost their money, livestock and land as well as being subservient to Pharaoh .
          History does repeat itself I believe.

      3. If you are having a discussion with an LDS Bishop he is way out of line and not following the direction from the LDS Church. The LDS position is very clear and published here. Start by obtaining a week, then a month then a three month. There is no modern day direction suggesting anything over one year worth of storage. We do not recommend doing anything extreme to obtain food storage (such as go into debt for preparedness!)

        The link below is the actual Church position on food storage:

        https://www.lds.org/topics/food-storage?lang=eng

        1. Carl ,
          You are correct.
          LDS are counseled to never go into debt.
          Sacrifice a little each week/month to build up your stores.
          Sound advice about debt.
          Wish the gov. would listen…

          1. BJH like the old story about wishes and horses :-)

            When the government got away from a Gold Backed Currency (and the limited Government that entailed) and the people learned they could vote themselves monies from the public purse the Government we fast tracked ourselves away from the Republic our Forefathers pledged their “Lives, Properties and Sacred Honor” for.

            7 years of plenty is done as far as I can see, here comes the 7 years of hunger. I’d like to be wrong but….. Store what you eat, eat what you store. A lot of “Gluten” sensitivities go away when you start with NON-GMO NOT Round Up ready wheat.

        2. It’s entirely possible that it was a historical note. The guideline was 7 years at one point.

      4. NRP,
        When I was younger it was 7 years ( I come from a very large Mormon family) then they moved it to 5 then 3 then 2 then 1 I guess they were just trying to get members to store something. Interesting that they have moved it back to 7 years,

        1. Brigham young counseled 7 years.
          2 years is ideal but 1 year is what my LDS friends told me.
          With what is going on in the world I understand wanting 7 years but how to store it all?
          That takes combined effort.
          I bet a lot of the fed bunkers have it.
          The rest of the sheep are SOL…

  3. Don’t disagree (assuming misprint on fruits and veggies – which has since been changed from per day to per year!).

    I do believe it can be adjusted for those living in locales where foraging for wild edibles and game can supplement the diet. I know this source can and probably will be depleted as time passes, but should be considered. Organizing an area to share harvested game, rather than every man for himself, could greatly reduce depletion from over harvesting and losses due to spoilage. Alliances with 2-3 families would make a couple of deer a month be a reasonable harvest. In my area, that would cover a couple of sections (2 square miles) without harming the deer herd numbers. Squirrels, and small game such as rabbit, possum, coons, etc. can supplement also. Don’t forget the fish in all the scattered ponds, lakes, and rivers. At the same time, remember hunting for protein is time consuming. Early expeditions assigned/hired experienced hunters for those full time tasks. If you can’t form alliances with your neighbors, a venison hind quarter would make a tempting barter item to trade for something you may need from them (and vice versa).

    Unless I missed it, I didn’t see mention of salt and spices. Makes some of the less desirable tasting protein sources more palatable. I see peppers of many kinds filling this role also. Peppers are some of the easiest to preserve veggies. Simply string them together and hang them up to dry. Chop ’em up or powder them and use for spicing up a stew or soup, or sprinkle on for a garnish.

    1. Might also mention that those raising chickens, rabbits, goats, sheep, hogs, etc. have a built in replenishing store of protein. My 15 young hens are producing over a dozen eggs a day free range, using very little supplemental feed. That works out to about 3 eggs a day for the five on my homestead. Just that source alone is a comfort to me, as I take my responsibilities as the provider for my flock seriously. I am always on the lookout for other resources I can utilize harvest. Check out every wild plant in your area as you range about, identify them, and find out if they are edible. Mark their location on a map of your area for future use. Record the time of year they are producing. Research how to prepare and cook them.

      Prepping for primitive survival will change the way you look at your environment.

      1. Dennis;
        Not wanting to argue/disagree with your good suggestions, and I agree 100% with them, but I believe the idea of having a 100% Deep Pantry of “Stored” foods for a full year is a perfect idea.
        We all have discussed the Golden Hordes and the probability of the “Forest” being overrun with looters, and all the other ‘problems’ that could interrupt the “outside” resources of replenishing.
        Again without arguing, but what/if your chickens came down with Bird Flu? or a HUGE drought dried up the area?
        Just saying, I think it’s a good idea to have that Pantry fully stocked, the ideas you present are a good extender to the stores…..
        Or am I off my Nut again? :-)

        1. NRP,

          I’m terribly offended! It’s my way or the highway Bub! (just kidding)

          No, I was taking into account both those that are struggling to prep for a just a few weeks cushion, and those working toward a years worth of survival but haven’t made it yet.

          My own preps are currently a good three months of our normal needs without being deprived of anything, plus my chickens, etc. My long term (around an additional three months of dried potato flakes, powdered milk, dried beans, peas, rice, spices etc. My foraging and hunting to supplement those.

          You read articles on the wealthy having custom bunkers built and stocked with 2-3 years of provisions with no hands on effort on their own part, just writing a check for it. I’m guessing not many on these pages can do that. (know I can’t)

          I’m not being a contrarian, just pointing out ways to stretch your existing stocks. I know we discuss such measures on a fairly regularly basis, but for a new visitor, adding this may convince them to hang around and share their experience.

          As a side note, others might try what I’m currently doing. I found myself gaining a lot of weight in retirement (13+ years). I had ballooned to 240 lbs. I’ve long planned on severely reducing my food intake, if we hit a long term shtf event, to stretch my stores as long as possible. So, about two and a half months ago, I reduced my food intake in half, partly as an experiment, and partly to lose some weight. The result, I’ve lost forty five pounds, and am still losing. The amazing thing, after the first two weeks, I never felt deprived. Granted, I’m not expending calories like I probably would in dawn to dusk fight for survival (with night over-watch), yet it does give me an idea how doing with less affects me.

          As for you being off your nut? Again? We haven’t figured out for sure what your normal is….. :-).

          1. Dennis;
            Again we are in agreement. A first I know, hehehehe :-)
            I must add to the ongoing conversations here, and on this article.

            For all those “Old Timers” and the Newbies to preparedness; please Please PLEASE keep going, Learn some new skills, learn how to Field and Process that Deer you got, Learn how to preserve meat without a freezer or canning.

            For if you think the threat is over, ya ain’t seen nada yet, the Crazies are going to go nuts-er.

            Also get that book Bill Jenkins Horse suggested, End of Food, it will scare the crapo out of ya if you understand it.

            PS; what’s that word??? “Normal”? and why?

      2. Dennis,
        My 9 hens, well one might be a rooster, hope not, anyway they are growing fast. Can’t wait for the first egg, probably 4 more months according to what I’ve read. I agree with you, this counts as food storage. I know, don’t count them before ya got em.

        1. Plainsmedic,

          As I recall, you were getting Rhode Island Reds. Most predictions are 5-6 months for egg laying to start, but don’t be surprised if they start earlier. Gives a lot of satisfaction knowing you’ve got a home source of good protein you can depend on. Early eggs will be small, some as small as bird eggs, growing larger as they (the hens) mature. Great hobby as well as worthy prep.

      3. Other things to note:….3 large eggs a day+ 21 grams of protein, with lots of choices as how to use… to add to cornbread, desert and divide evenly, To rotate among the youngest, or weakest.
        RE: Sugars, if you have fruit on your property , it takes quite a bit to make jellies and jams, if you have bees honey can be used.

        I have been canning meats for a few years.. when I buy a months supply of meats and have some left at end of month. ( maybe I made more stretcher meals by adding meat to pasta or rice dish, .) I buy fresh, supply , can all the older, not used and 1/4th of the new supply. Doing this routinely, will build your meat supply faily quickly. I put all of mine in pints,( sausage patties- 1/2 pints-6 pattties) Remember variety is the spice of life.
        Fats are also another concern.. Salt should be kept in quanity to secure meat should there be no electricity…100-200 lb would be a good starting place. for most families.
        Canned pork fat is routinely used 5 years old by one of my friends from web. she cans it with very little headspace, puts in sterilized jars and lids/ pours hot fat in jars…says it tastes like ti was just prepared. she does not know the limit on it yet.

        One lb of pork loin a can of rotel tomatoes, a large clove of garlic, a little flour and few tablespoons of oil will make a pit of green chili , for 6 large servings.(or canned pork from commercial supplier 24 oz can has about 18 oz of pork in can with broth cooked out of meat and some fat,.enough to make gravy or green chili.)

        When I have bones from meats purchased, or harvested. I put them in a bag , when I have enough.. make Bone broth. to use in place of Bullion, since that is an item we are deleting from our pantry( high in MSG a neurotoxin- Yes, it can be found in nature but the stuff in bullion and meat tenderizers is a chemical manufactured ..It increases dh’s nerve pain.)

        I have more than the amount of grains and would like to double the amount. wheat and other whole grains , can be frozen to kill larvae, then stored in buckets/barrells. they THEN can be sprouted for vegetables and wheat is really high in the B vitamins and once sprouted are gluten free. the sprouting process uses the gluten…if dried after sprouting, can be used for bread.

        If the solar minimum does come, we will need every trick in the book to use to extend our food supply.It is thought it could last several years. Foods that require long growing seasons may not have time to make with traditional methods. Hoop houses, and other intense gardening methods will be most helpful to those who have experimented /grown in them.

        1. Excellent post JS
          Theres a lot to all this stuff, most people will fail as the learning curve is quite steep, easier to fail than to succeed

    2. Dennis, I believe that the list above (via LDS member recommendations) are just the basics, the staples so to speak. We have numerous articles here on MSB about food storage and many of the extras beyond just the basics – spices, condiments, ‘feel good’ foods, and more…

    3. The calorie count seems pretty good. A SHTF scenario would be a stressful time. As a result, people would tend to eat more when stressed or bored. So, what I am saying is that unless a meal plan is strictly adhered to, a years supply might last considerably less than a year. People know how it is, they eat a big lunch and then snack all afternoon sitting and watching Sunday football.

  4. Anony Mee;
    Thanks for writing the Article, and contributing.

    1 years of food is, or should be, a goal for anyone that wants to Prepare; Per each Person of course. Think about it, 755 pounds of food PER PERSON…. So can ya say a TON of food for 3 people? Holy Cow!!!!

    Storing this amount of food, and recycling it (rotating it) can be a project in-of itself, Hence I really encourage anyone with a deep pantry to keep a very accurate log of the stores. Food is wayyyyy to expensive and valuable to allow becoming unusable.

    I know a LOT of the LDS/Mormon folks here, none of them talk about their Deep Pantry much without asking direct questions, although they will share info once asked the correct way. One person and I got into a discussion about Wheat Berries, he stated that he buys Wheat by the Ton, just for his Family.
    One of the interesting places I know of is the LDS Store, they will sell to the public, but have limited ‘Kinds’ of foods, they are a good source.

    I really believe that when planning and building the Deep Pantry one should concentrate on the foods currently eaten, Yes storing 400 may work in theory, eating 8-10 slices of Bread a day may not fit so well on the belly….
    So back to my favorite saying, “Store what you eat, Eat what you store”. Yes I have several hundred pounds of Misc. Grain stored and use it constantly (I don’t buy Flour) I’m thinking that the 400 pounds recommended would last more like 5 years for me, Just Saying.

    I agree with hermit us, the space needed can become extraordinary, especially when you toss in the TP for 4 people, figuring 1 roll per person per week, 208 rolls, now add ALL the rest of the “STUFF” needed to be 100% self-sufficient for a year with ZERO outside ‘help’.

    Can you just think of the Water needed for one year?

  5. BJH
    Did you find the whole air dried milk yet? If not found a company in the USA, owned by the employees. They have a great selection of products but the smallest amount is 10lbs, price..not listed. You can request samples of their products.
    Let me know if you want the name of the company.

    What once was an easy food item to locate on several sites, is now a product n.ot readily available.

    1. Antique Collector,
      Do you know if that company has lactose free air dried milk ? If I could, please let me know what the name of the company is.
      Thank you

      1. gannyo
        Can they have whey in the product? If so, check out Honeyville’s milk line you may find what you are looking for there.

        Do you have a flour mill near you or where they reside? Depending on the mill(s) you can find products not normally listed, as they can carry specialized products for their area’s clientele.

        Still looking for the other address mentioned but it was via another search engine an stored it on that site.

  6. “Daily: 8-10 slices of bread, 1-1/2 cups cooked pasta, 2 cups cooked rice, 1 cup cooked oatmeal, 4 cups popped popcorn, AND 1/2 cup misc.”

    I think that should be OR.

    Even that is too much for me.

    Can I just substitute one box of cookies daily for all the grain?

    1. Daisy K
      30 Oreos (not double stuff!) has about 1,600 calories and 30 grams of protein. Works for me!

    2. DaisyK

      30 Oreos (not the double stuff!) gives 1,600 calories and 30 grams of protein. Works for me, too.

  7. Food storage and food requirements are not the same and should probably be calculated separately. For example, we store a lot of dry goods like grains, legumes, pasta, salt etc. but we also grow and barter a lot of vegetables and fruits throughout the year as well as herbs. The dry storage items are just one part of the foundation while fresh garden items are another part and home canned items are still another as is meat. You can categorize the garden items further by separating out all the things that have long natural shelf life, like winter squash which becomes part of the long term storage but not something you should include as such because of other variables like seasonal realibility or spoilage, which doesn’t generally apply to long term storage food items. All the things you can either grow to eat fresh or can or barter should not be considered part of long term storage because they are readily available and consumable but they still constitute a large percentage of your daily consumption. Canning adds a different dimension altogether. So, when you are calculating how much you need to store you should take into consideration your ability to grow, make and can the things that are not dry storage. Your storage footprint then becomes much smaller. Our daily needs are met in part by each of these things altogether. I am aware that this may not apply to those of you who are not able to grow a sustainable garden. I’ll stop growing, making and canning things when hell freezes over or I die. 😉 I’m just giving a different perspective to long term storage.

    This will be my last post because I will not provide my real email address, sorry. Just saying.

    1. CrabbeNebulae;
      I agree, for the most part, although “future” foods, aka growing a Garden to eat next week, should not be considered, as I believe you said.
      Only what’s on the shelf, and I agree those home-canned foods are defiantly on my list of Deep Pantry.

      PS; who uses their “real” email, I have several what I call “Junk” addresses. I do believe Ken has it set so one needs to actually type in a Name and Email to slow down the Trolls some.

      1. CrabbeNebulae;
        PS; you just used an Email, to post this, so keep using it…… Makes sense to me.

        1. You are right… my bad. It’s just that it has never been “required” before so I never entered one and didn’t have to lie about it in so doing. I try to avoid things that fall into the “required” or “mandatory” category. That’s just my nature. :)

          1. CrabbeNebulae;
            Understood, and not to worry till you see Social Security Number required, than back away 3 steps, turn and RUN!!!!!! :-)

          2. CN
            You can’t hide. Just go to Google Earth and type in NRP. You will see Animas river and NRP with Blue waving up at you. He has given us so many clues that my SatNav can be set to drive there. :)

    2. CrabbeNebulae,
      One thing that people do need to remember is that if they plan on canning a lot of their food they need to store canning supplies, salt, lids, jars, etc. I have a lot of Tattler lids put back I have used a few but have a bunch in storage you might even save your old lids I know a lot of people who reuse lids if they are taken off without denting them.

      And speaking of squash I saw something the other day where people use to make flour out of their large zucchinis think I am going to have to try this.

  8. Thank you AnonyMee for the contribution. Always nice to get yet another perspective.
    Like Dennis, much of my food is currently alive and either on the hoof, claw or in the greenhouse. I DO have enough “stored” for all 42 family members for 2 years! Isn’t THAT crazy? Have to tell you keeping it clean, vermin free and rotated is almost a full time job in itself. But, that it what I committed to for the benefit of the family…..so we carry on! I have many pounds of spices stored because we HATE bland food! Those are the most difficult to rotate appropriately, because you certainly do NOT want them to go rancid or lose their potency. We grow a good amount of those as well….but the exotics like ginger and tumeric and cumin….well….not in Colorado. I have tried to keep a ginger root going through the winter, but it is really difficult at 9k feet.

    1. Pioneer Woman (and Ken)
      How about an article on spices that talks about how long they really last? I have many pounds stored of about 35 spices and keep them cool, dry and dark. I was not aware, however, that some or all of them could go rancid… Any thoughts?

  9. Hi AC,
    That would be great.

    As usual, other pressing issues got in the way of me doing research on the dry milk.

    I bet others would be interested as well.

    I too see choices of products either not available or simply disappeared from the shelves and online catalogs.

    It might have something to do with these huge food companies buying up the smaller ones.

    Armour and Nestle (for example) are monster companies who control so many ” brand name” products.

    I recommend folks read “The End Of Food”.

    That book is an eye opener.

    1. BJH, THAT book IS an eye opener. More importantly, it exposes a huge agenda that many of us here on MSB already are aware of. Still, there is a large part of society that has not awakened to the evil in the world.
      One of the other items not discussed in the deep pantry is vitamins and supplements. MANY of these are getting harder to find in good quality. A number of studies re: Wally world suppliers shows terrible and even fraudulent quality. I would encourage everyone that uses specific supplements ( such as I do for control of my RA) to stock up from a bulk supplier while you can! Kept in dark dry place, last for MANY years!!!

      1. PW,
        Vitamins are a good choice.
        The quality is always a concern.
        What type of supplements are you taking for RA?

    2. BJH
      Looked up several companies that whole dried dairy can be purchased through. Down to a few choices: Amazon, Walmart, All American Foods, and Hoosier Hill Farms. I was impressed with the Hoosier Hill farms product line, prices are within reason with these being limited to the market availability. Amazon does offer a lower price on some of Hoosier products, which would go into Ken’s piggy bank.
      The All American Foods, it appears you would be purchasing in 10lbs up to 50lb bags. That is a supposition on my part, they have a fill in request sheet to try samples of their products for free, and it appears you are able to select a few, not limited to just one.

      Had started the book “End of Food”, when fire season began around here. Items that need to be stored away are put up off site and that book was one of the items off this piece of land.

    3. I saw a box of dried milk on the LDS website. It looks like a pretty decent amount of dried milk. I have not run the economics yet to see how it compares to buying in the regular grocery store or cost per serving.

      1. Hi INPrepper

        I think it was NH Michael who shared LDS stores as a good source. Thanks again NHM!

        LDS nonfat dry milk comes 12 pouches to a box. $4.50 per pouch if picked up ($54 per box) or $5.00 per pouch if ordered online ($60). One pouch is 28 oz (1.75 lb) and contains 29 three tablespoon servings (skosh less than an oz per serving). Packaged for 20-year shelf life.

        I’ve purchased some staples from them. Very worthwhile to drive RT of 250 miles when the cost of hard red wheat packed in #10 cans is $15 for a case of six cans (32-1/2 lbs per case) vs $32.25 if ordered online. Google LDS store to find price list and locations. When I go, I fill the car.

    4. If you have dried milk sitting around that no one will use, keep it around for bokashi, lacto-fermentation, and garden food.

    5. I wish I could afford it. I tried to get it at the library, reserved the only copy, and it never arrived. Apparently they had lost it and hadn’t purged it from their system. Which makes no sense whatsoever, since it was listed as being checked out when I reserved it.

  10. Anony Mee, Thank you for this post. A more realistic amount for survival. Some FD foods at a 1 ounce serving would barely keep one alive not to mention a vitamin deficiency. They push the carbs.

  11. I’ve started to really concentrate on “foraging” around here. I’m learning and trying to make lists of what’s available and where. Hey NRP, I’m also noting the locations of lamb’s ear to be used as tp if necessary. I’ve used it in the woods before and it works quite well. Big leaves and oh sooo soft. Walnuts, persimmons, mushrooms though I’m still only confident in murells, etc. Gleaning farmer’s fields for milo, dent corn, soybeans, etc. I’ve asked a couple of local farmers and they both laughed, saying have at it after the harvest.

    Do these things count as food storage? I think so, if ya know where it is.

  12. I’m a bit confused. The 400 lbs of grains seems a bit high. That would equal a little over a pound a day, and that is the dry weight. If you cook a pound of rice, its going to be allot heavier when its done. I can’t eat that much in one day. I know the grains include things like flour and oats but if we are eating one, chances are we wont be eating the other.

  13. Thanks to A-Mee for the post. It really gets one thinking.

    I came from a family which had ties to local agriculture. We were the asians that grew vegetables. We bought and stored approx 7 – 80 lb sacks of white rice for a family of 6 people. ( 2 adults and 4 kids to include teenagers that go through food like jet engines go through aviation fuel.)

    Obtaining meat from the wild was a bonus that could not be counted upon butt it was there by virtue of the fields of lettuce and greens were a magnet for any herbivores during times of drought. This is why farm kids became adept at taking head shots at game at far distances.

    To those raising chickens , rabbits or other penned animals, your pens are protein factories set up which will attract the meat eaters. For those in coyote rich areas, I have seen many who will keep a few donkeys around mixed in with the livestock because the donkeys make life very tough on any coyote that comes in their enclosure. I also understand that geese are still used to guard the perimeter of US airbases in Germany.

    From the above comments, One can tell that I am in the same camp as Dennis. We are both hunters and shooters butt if one is going to begin raising their own vegetables and meat, One can either learn to trap and shoot or they end up contacting a local person to do that work for them.

    the Bible states “7 fat years followed by 7 lean years”. During my 7 lean years in my youth, I took side jobs of controlling pests around farms and ranches of my relatives. I repaired distant stretches of fence line for ranchers on their “back 40” with the fencing tools in a mud bucket and a scoped rifle and deer tags on my person.

    I made it through that time of limited income, seasonal employment and intermittent work by engaging in the barter economy. Friends used to joke that I ate roadkill and were generally afraid to eat any casserole I made. My truck smelled like a skunk and I cleared out a cobbler shop by bringing in a pair of boots to be resoled after walking through skunk spray that morning.

    The downside was: The game wardens knew me on a first name basis and they greeted me by patting me down rather than shaking my hand. Some one put a big black stripe of tape from front to back over my white truck so it not only smelled like a skunk butt it looked like one too. Nothing compares to the Animal Rights Activists that broke out the windows of my truck though. ( From then on- work in quiet anonymity.).

    Now with a steady job, those were considered fun times. Many Mormons I knew who had the deep pantries also had guns around not only for protection butt also to obtain food from farm or field as well.

    1. Calirefugee,

      The largest town in our county (pop 2000) held it’s annual “Road Kill Cook Off” last weekend. Menu was restricted to animals subject to being run over on the roads. Squirrel, possum, coon, rabbit, turtle, and deer.

      1. Then there was the old man who’s stew was loved by everyone. They asked him why he called it Himalayan stew. He said, “I didn’t say it was Himalayan stew, I said I found him a layin’ in the road.”

  14. There is one source of food storage not mentioned. All that extra weight some of us are lugging around will help mitigate our calorie needs, at least initially. I am not saying that we should pack on the pounds now. In fact, just the opposite. We should all get healthy and have a good weight. But the reality is, when SHTF happens, some of us are going to be carrying around 20, 30, 40 extra pounds. That 40 pounds equals 140,000 calories. If you cut back your consumption by a 1000 calories a day, you get 140 days worth just by burning your fat! Again, don’t do this. Get healthy. You will need the energy then and would rather not be reducing your intake. But if push comes to shove, you are carrying some calories around with you already.

    1. Burt G
      When I lived just south of Siberia we were advised to lard on an extra 15 to 25 extra pounds in the fall. Medics told us we would shiver it off by late spring. Yep, we did.

  15. Anony Mee
    This is great article, thank you for doing the research. It is something I required to see who we are setting for storage but never get around to doing.

  16. Tommyboy
    You asked question on milk storage a couple of days back. Beside my knowledge, found an old web page with a how to give you a guide line on how to store this product. It is preparedessmama from 11/21/2014, it will give a basic idea on preserve it on the island.

    Reason using canning jars, it gives one a choice of putting the product in amounts which will be used in a timely fashion. Use a canning lid (or the plastic reusables lids) to lightly tighten, then place in a vacuum seal bag for storage. Process the jar as if you were sealing a food item, then place into a Mylar bag. If you have the extra large Mylar bags you can use old socks with the bottoms cut off to make two sets of coverings to protect the jars from hitting and breaking.

    HINT: There are Mylar bags with the zip lock tops available on the market, which come in quart to 2-3 gallon size for easy access.

    1. I wonder if vacuum sealing in 1/2 gallon mix size portions with oxy absorber and dessicant pack would extend it?
      Could seal up a whole bunch of them then toss them in a 5 gallon bucket inside a resealable mylar bag.

      1. Tommyboy
        Getting the jar inside a vacuum bag will be the problem, you would have to use the large bags for the 1/2 gallon. Besides what you mentioned above, keeping it in the dark where it stays pretty cool for longevity.

        I use pint jars since I purchase it by the pound, and usually 5lb bags. Will go through our storage to see if we have any of it has been a few years.

        Saw what 0ldhomesteader said about milk at TSC. If it smells anything like what we fed our calves when I was younger, I will pass on it.
        Will stay with what we purchase from the flour mill.

        1. AC
          I was not really thinking about using a jar,
          Was thinking just make pouches. Cosco has big bags of powdered milk, pretty cheap, if you mix it with extra powder or less milk its ok, is better than nothing, and you get used to it. blended with some banannas is pretty good.

          1. Tommyboy
            If it is a pouch depending on the make up of the material, you might use a needle to poke a hole in the bag. That air is removed out of the package when you vacuum seal them in vacuum bags. Then place into a Mylar bag for processing. Mark the product and date…good to go for a while

  17. Anony Mee,
    Very good post. I would also recommend everyone get the book “Passport to Survival” by Esther Dickey the things that she can make for wheat, powdered milk, honey, and salt is just amazing things you would never think of.

    1. And that would be “with” not “for” ugh can’t even blame spell check on that one.

  18. A tip on milk powder ,,,you can get dryed whole milk at tractor supply ,it’s sold as a calf milk replacer ,,,you want unmedicated whole milk ,replacer ,,,it’s made in the same plant and to the same standards as the stuff in the grocery store ,,only difference is packing ,used it on my vacations with W H O. In Ethiopia ,,feeding/saving babies ,,,,,we also used pour on cattle wormer on the moms and small kids,,, yep same stuff we get for cows here ,in fact same packaging

    1. Homesteader,
      Was wondering about that,,,
      Funny you mentioned that, as soon as i read it i had a scent memory mixing bottles for orphan calvs we used to raise, soent many years mixing up that powder. Is a scent you dont forget,

    2. Oldhomesteader,

      Used a ton of that milk replacer over the years. Even tried some myself just to see. Not good, but I say the same about the powdered milk in the stores. I’m guessing it would work great for cooking. When I drink any powdered milk, the trick for me is to drink it ice cold. Correct me if I’m wrong, but the calf milk replacer is whole milk with the fat, not skim milk like in stores.

      Since those fifty pound sacks from the feed store get man handled quite a bit, would probably make sense to re-bag it in smaller mylar bags with an oxygen absorber.

    3. Oldhomesteader,
      Thanks for the tip, I have always wondered about that have some in the shed may have to get some out. Also, need to do a cost comparison since milk replacer is pretty pricey but if it is cheaper per ounce may have to start stocking that. Wonder if it is like Nido powdered milk. If it is you could make butter with it.

    4. When with W H O,,we would add vanilla and sugar ,, to get the kids to drink it ,,,
      Some milk replacer is made with soy ,,,,,,i won’t even feed that to calfs ,,yes the good stuff has the butter fat in it,
      OBTW working with W H O was one of the turning points in my life , Some good , Some not so good ,,, and yes it was on my vacation ,,,no sandy beaches ,, no pina coladas ,,,

      1. Oldhomesteader, I just add vanilla at one teaspoon per gallon and the kids loved it. Sometimes would use almond extract and they liked that too. No sugar, but served very cold.

    5. Old Homesteader,
      Thanks for this tip. We do not drink much milk, but others will, and this is a good way to store it up. BTW- milk replacer is used in pyrotechnics to make huge ‘fireballs’. (But then again, I bet you knew that already.) might be good to know about for diversionary tactics. How are your mine tunnels going?

    6. Yeah, I know the smell of calf milk replacer well after feeding it to calves for years. Of course I took sips of the stuff. Just sips since it was the medicated stuff. I now use it exclusively for the cats as it helps them when they get that garbage on their eyes and funky noses. Fixes them up good, plus they love drinking it as well. One thing I really miss was the calf feed. It was whole corn and wheat and other stuff mixed with molasses. Awesome stuff as I would often grab a handful to munch on while feeding.

  19. Thanks all for jumping in.

    Yep, it’s a lot of basic food, designed I imagine, to get one through days of nonstop heavy lifting. And a lot of fiber from whole grains. So, NRP, there might be additional pressure on your TP stores. Would 600 rolls EVER be enough?

    I was surprised by how much food it actually was. For my family, this is the long-term store it and forget it stock. For dire emergencies and JIC. With enough salt and sugar to have salted caramel for life. And spices, yeast, etc.

    Initial orchard was planted a couple years ago, garden and herb beds going in now, first chickens on site. Hope to have goats, pigs, tank fish, and more poultry by this time next year. Elk in the meadow, trout in the stream, salmon in the river, and blackberries covering everything else will be available to sustain us as needed. And, like we all do, I hope and pray that the LTS moulders into dust, or is fed to the birds, decades from now never having been needed.

    1. Anony Mee:
      Thanks again for contributing the Article, good job, and a lot of good feedback y-all.
      How about orhers writing up some good info and sending it to Ken, I know he’s thankful for the daily Article help.
      Would be great to take a little load off the OLD MAN 😁 and it’s good to hear from others on ideas…..
      PS: Ken is a great editor, so not to worry

      1. NRP

        Yer welcome. And thanks to Ken for MSB; it was his articles that got me thinking along this line.

        If effective preparedness is possible, for me it will be significantly because of Ken and all those who comment here.

        BTW it averages out to one roll per person every four days at my house. Women tend to wipe more often. Thank goodness for rural septic systems and a wood burning stove for all that paper once tank pumping is not an option.

        1. Anony Mee, Thanks. I have thousands of articles here (some worse than others ;) ) and I’m glad they have been influential for your preparedness motivations!

  20. For y-all thinking on storing “milk replacer” remember it has a LOT of milk fats in it, and we all know about storing Fats…. Right?

    1. NRP
      “We all know about storing Fats….Right? NOOOoooo
      That is why Oreo cookies are fat free, wafer cookies, oatmeal/raisin, and of course homemade chocolate chip. lol

  21. And remember, when you get to 70 and 80 you don’t have to rotate food. Eat the new stuff! You might as well. Your heirs can eat the old stuff.

  22. Got a book a few years back (99 cent Kindle sale) “Food Self-Sufficiency Reality Check” by Susan Gregersen,… Eye opening (for me) at the time but I can sum it up in 3 words… “Do the Math!”

    What do you need for a week (including rotating diet so you aren’t eating beans and rice all week.) Visualize that in your “store room” (what ever that may be).

    Multiply by 4 for a month…. multiply that by 3 for a quarter and that by 4 for a year…

    THEN you can refine what “What do you need for a week” (immediate family, extended family, neighbors and so on..) and continue to do the math.

    The key to all of that though is to know what you actually have in your stores (I only stock what we actually eat so we can rotate it…. Plus some MH freeze dried meals we keep in each get home bag and since they are in the cars we have a “survival weekend” every 6 months or so to use them up and rotate them)

    My key decision this month is do I buy another 12-16 cans of beef or do I try (first time) to can some up myself (bit cheaper and a good skill to hone but it’s still pretty cheap at Costco!)

  23. I do not need what is recommended in amount for one year. One year would last me three years or more. Everyone burns calories different. My metabolism takes only 500 calories to maintain itself with activity AND walking a mile a day AND a 30 minute exhausting workout. I found this out last year when I went on a diet and discovered I have become an economy model or I came from another planet. I had to do all the above with 300 calories a day and multi-vitamins, and I finally lost 1 pound a week a total of 15 lbs. I went to a doctor for what is wrong with me? Nothing is wrong, but my bad cholesterol is on the edge of low/high and recommended me to exercise more and eat less hoofed meat. Huh? I can’t do any more to improve diet or exercise. Know what is in a 300 calorie, or even a 500 calorie a day diet? So now instead of one year supply, I have 3 years, and I didn’t have to buy anymore supplies.

    1. Stardust – Ha! Great comment! Wish I was more like you.

      Doctors . . .

      Everyone makes cholesterol, and in different amounts, as well as consumes and metabolizes it differently. My mother was an itty bitty woman. She forced herself to maintain a bare-minimum healthy weight only because she was a committed blood donor. At one point several tragedies came crashing into her life and she became a nervous wreck. She lived on black coffee, cigarettes, and carrots (I kid you not) for quite a few years. Finally went to the doctor when she turned orange from all the carotene. Dr said her cholesterol was too high and to cut back on the heavy food.

      My bad cholesterol is high, but my good cholesterol is through the roof. Dr says as long as my ratio is good not to worry.

  24. Probably not a good post from a type one diabetic…..and Just Sayin’ can intervene…..
    On the weekends I unusually eat one good meal once a day, workdays a simple sandwich, then a good supper. Usually p and j.
    Not that I concur as a healthy lifestyle, but moderating myself to possibilities of what if’s.
    A year’s worth of food?…..the deep pantry is spilling over to the other side of the basement.
    The idea of dispersing food items needs to be on everyone’s mind.

  25. There is no mention that most of the weight you’re talking about here is water weight. That’s key in understanding how much food you’re actually storing.

    It would be better, and more helpful, to specify the actual dry food amounts and then talk about how much water needs to be stored (or acquired somehow; i.e. well, etc.) to supply the water needed for drinking and cooking.

    I can see some getting confused and thinking that they need to store that much in the dry state; which would hugely overstate the amount of food required.

    Just a thought.

  26. Hey Duke Norfolk,

    A thorough reading of the article and references will show that, for other than wet sugars, there is no water weight in the LDS 755 lb annual recommendation. The narrative lists the bulk recommendations and what that translates into as daily servings of prepared food (which is the answer to my question How Much Food IS That?). The narrative also includes the comment that a gallon or more of water per person per day would be needed to reconstitute and cook this amount of dried food. That’s close to 3,000 lbs of water for one person for one year.

    RedStix113 commented Do the Math. The math is startling.

    1. And it should go without saying, water is a #1 concern for those who are of the mindset to be prepared in other ways for 1 year. It’s another subject altogether (and there are many articles here on the blog about it), however it’s worth mentioning here. The best solution is to have a water source nearby (stream, lake, pond, etc..), or better yet on one’s own property! Water Filter too!

      Search: “water”
      Search “water filter”

    2. Anony Mee, Duke Norfolk, Ken
      Have to chuckle a little at this conversation,
      I (the community) lost water last afternoon, and did not come back on till this morning (just in time for the morning shower :-) )

      Than read the comment on 3000# of water being a lot. Did the quick “Math” on the 1000 gallons stored…. 8340 pounds, Sure glad it’s not on a wood floor hehehehe, PLUS 30+ cases of Bottled water in the house….

      Had a neighbor call and ask, told them to run to the store for a few cases of Bottled Water, and get a 5 gallon bucket from the River for the toilet….. Yep, 5 minutes later I spot them at the River……. They asked about me and if I needed them to pick me up some bottles at the store, Thanked them and said I’m good.

      Makes ya wonder don’t it?

      1. NRP

        That’s your technicolor river, correct? Unless your neighbors are brand new to the area it really does make one wonder.

  27. To Ken, NRP Tommyboy and Dennis:

    I reviewed my post from yesterday and realized that my talk of being an asian driver and roadkill in the same conversation may have triggered somebody.

    I wish to apologize for my indiscretion and I want to thank Ken for the ongoing efforts to keep this site free of Trolls.

    To Joe c : If your blood sugars are within range and you feel OK there is nothing wrong with what you are doing. As a nurse, I find it difficult to lecture anybody about blood sugar and diet management when I am not diabetic myself. I look to the old experienced diabetics for ways to cope. Some are better than others and we must each find our own way to manage our diet and health status.

    I find it difficult to get a lecture about diet and exercise from 2 types of people: #1 the anorexic former cheerleader or #2 the heavyset person that smells like stale cigarettes.

    1. Calirefugee:

      1. You’re an Asian Driver??????? :-)
      AND Yes I have “splatted” a few Deer in my life, even totaled two cars doing so, what a MESS HAHAHAH
      2. What Indiscretion????
      3. I’m heavyset aka F-A-T, but don’t smell like garettes… hehehehe

      Tis all good my friend, tis all good.

    2. My bush guard/animal guard has saved my truck a couple of times. I don’t know what an Asian driver is, but I’m pretty sure I haven’t hit any. :) No nationality or color bothers me unless I get flipped the bird for just being on the road. I laughed at the Himalayan meal plan but have never tried any road kill.

    3. Cali-
      Thank you, sir.
      And Lol on the last…..
      These new epipen insulins I’m on are perfect for my lifestyle. One 24 hr shot and one when I eat.
      With the old insulin I was using it was a mixed shot twice a day. Regardless
      Most of the time I had to force myself to eat. Or being stuck on project, I would skip eating.
      Had lots of problems, mostly with lows
      I occasionally have highs and lows now, but not even close to the way it was before.

    4. Calirefugee,

      There was a time in America when humor/comedy hinged on relating things that may be uncomfortable to some ears, but always had an element of truth that everyone knew to be true of some, but not all of the group seemingly being targeted. That was before so many spent their lives looking for reasons to be offended. Rest assured, I am not a member of the modern day perpetually p!ssed (my descriptive term for left wing democrats).

      You being former law enforcement, are familiar with “cop humor”. Many folks outside law enforcement get offended by things cops share with each other, finding humor in horrific events. Folks that aren’t exposed to the underbelly of our society on a daily basis, can’t imagine getting a chuckle out of some aspect involving brutality beyond many’s belief. Folks can’t see that this is a mental game within their own psyche to cope with the steady stream of depravity they deal with on a regular basis.

      Oh well, I’m rambling again. Point is, I’m not easily offended.

  28. Calirefugee
    Na, all is good bud, not that sensitive about much.
    Lifes too short to be too serious or sensitive!
    Besides i dont even know what might have been the issue,
    😎🤙🏻

  29. Our family keeps a supply of foods that we regularly eat and that is rotated regularly. Because we anticipate having more people at the farm in a long term crisis situation, we store more than we can rotate of some of these store canned foods so anything close to out of date that we cannot eat is donated to the food pantry. These types of foods include what I call my quicky meals. That is my home canned foods that are mixed with rice, beans, or pasta.

    In long term situation, I expect we are going to be eating different using the same stuff we store. Store or home canned soup over rice. Store or home canned sauce over pasta. Store and home canned Beans and rice stews with meat added. We keep spices, store and home dehydrated for the variations. Bone broth, frozen and canned, depending upon time available. Freeze dried veggies help these items when the stored potatoes, carrots, onions are depleted and not yet grown out. Also sprouts help in this area. Meats will be stretched out and not devoured in one sitting and bone bones will be cooked down into broth to use all the nutrients of the meat kill.

    The wheat, corn, and oats will be used in many different ways, including adding to stews or cooked for breakfast. We will appreciate our chickens, ducks, and animals on the hoof.

    It takes a tremendous amount of space to store this amount of food and takes a long while to accumulate. Lots of attention to keep it rotated. That is why it is a life style and not a store and forget program, although you can choose to do that with many items, you will save money if you buy these standard items on sale or can or dehydrate your own…. but you have an initial investment of the equipment needed. Also investment of time learning how to do these things….lots of trial and error.

    And, unless you have items stored in different places, it is still at risk – yet another conundrum. Makes my head want to explode at times. But making lists, and taking one step at a time keeps me sane. Figure out what you eat and what you are willing to try (now), buy when on sale, store the surplus, rotate the surplus when you buy new. Before long, it becomes the new norm for you. And mark that expiry date in black marker in visible area so you can use it to rotate from that dark area you have it tucked away because our eyes are not getting any better. Many items are good past the expiry date but the food pantry won’t take them.

    Thank you for the article Anony Mee! Lots of good thoughts for us to consider.

  30. If you look at history of the Klondike Gold rush the RCMP would not let anyone in to the area that did not have 1000lbs of food. They considered that to be one years worth of food. And remember that this food and supplies had to be carried up and over the pass.

  31. Stopped by the LDS store today. Guys there said their refried beans product was being discontinued. Stocked up.

    Refried beans are good on or in just about everything; and tasty all by themselves. They’re quick and easy too – add water and stir after a bit. LDS has 2.4 lbs of dehydrated refried beans in a #10 can for $6. They sell for a little more online. Way less expensive than most other sources.

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